Thru the Bible - Questions & Answers

Guest (Male): Scripture mentions several personalities who go by the name of James, so which of these actually wrote the book of James? We'll find out the answer to this question and more when you stay with us for this broadcast.

You're listening to the Question and Answer program with our Bible teacher, Dr. J. Vernon McGee, who answered the questions of his listeners for over 30 years. This is a ministry of the Thru the Bible Radio Network. A Long Beach, California listener starts our program today with a question about several specific scripture references. He says, "Would you please explain 1 Peter 3:19 to 20, 1 Peter 4:6, as well as 1 Corinthians 14:17?"

Dr. J. Vernon McGee: The first one is 1 Peter 3:19 and 20. It says, "By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison." Now I think I should drop back and read the verse before this so we'll find out who the "he" is. "For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit. By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison, which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water."

Now may I just give you this preliminary word, and it's this: that Peter in his epistles did not write the best Greek. In other words, he has quite a few dangling phrases and clauses. And as a result, sometimes a time word—it's always there, but it's in a position where we sometimes might miss the meaning. And this is a passage of scripture that has been greatly and grossly misunderstood because the impression is given that Christ, when he died on the cross, went down and spoke to those who were drowned in the flood—to the spirits of those.

But that's not when he did it at all, because there is a time phrase here, a clause, and it opens with the adverb "when," and it tells us, when did Christ, who has suffered for our sins, and he was put to death in the flesh and quickened by the Spirit—when did he go down and preach to the spirits in prison? May I say, he preached to them when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing.

For 120 years, Noah preached, and let me also say that Christ preached through Noah during those 120 years way back at the time of the flood. Just read your time word there, and you won't have any trouble with it at all. It's really very clear. And now let's turn to your other verse, 1 Peter 4:6. And it says here, "For this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit."

Now here again, it's nothing in the world but just a simple lesson in grammar. And all you have to do is to pay attention to the tense of the verbs. Now will you notice this? And the two verbs are here: they "are" dead and the gospel "was" preached. Now will you notice, "for this cause was the gospel preached also to them." They are dead now, but when the gospel was preached to them, they were alive. Do you get it?

May I say to you, it's a very simple lesson in grammar. Fact of the matter is, Simon Peter was not as fluent in Greek as Paul and Luke were. And as a result, why, his two epistles are not written in the best of Greek. And sometimes a thing like this throws you off, but all you have to do is just pay attention to some simple lessons in grammar. And if you listen to grammar and also listen to Grandpa, why, you won't have any trouble at all.

The gospel was preached. The people to whom it was preached, they are dead now. It wasn't that the gospel was preached to people that are dead, or they were dead when the gospel was preached to them. They were not dead, they were alive then, but they're dead now. That's the thing that he's saying. Now I trust that we have clarified those two verses for you.

Now I turn to this verse that you've given me, 1 Corinthians 14, verses 14 through 17. "For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also. I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also. Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest? For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified."

Now what Paul is saying in this entire passage of scripture here is that the Corinthians were taking the subject of tongues to the excess. And this was the day of the tongues, by the way—the early church, when there was a real manifestation of them. And yet Paul rebukes the Corinthians because they were going to an excess with tongues.

Now he said to them, when you come together for a service and you attempt to speak in tongues, nobody's edified because nobody understands you. Therefore, he says, the thing to do in the private life, if you pray in the spirit, fine, but even you don't know what you're saying if you do that. What you need to do is to pray with your understanding. And therefore when you come together in a service, you talk, not in tongues, but talk with an understanding so people will know what you're talking about.

May I say that that's the soundest advice. And remember, that was given in a day when the church was just getting started and tongues were a real manifestation. Now they're not today. And if that was a word of caution for that day, it certainly ought to put the zipper on the mouth of a great many folk today that are spouting off, saying something that they don't know what they're saying and nobody else does, and nobody's edified. They're not a sign. They just cause the unbeliever to ridicule and intelligent people to pass by and pay no attention to the gospel today.

I am convinced myself that a great deal of so-called religious expression in Southern California is driving more people away from the gospel than it's bringing people to the gospel. I'm convinced of that. I think there's evidence of that just now, that a great many people are passing by and are not listening to the gospel at all. And the reason I think is easy to understand.

You can certainly understand that an intelligent person is not going to sit and listen to some person jabber away in an unknown tongue, and you can say it's of the Holy Spirit if you want to. But Paul says, when you come together in a service, you speak with your understanding. I think it's good advice, my friend.

Guest (Male): Here's a very interesting question from a listener in Thornton, Illinois. She writes, "When did clergymen as we know them today, that is as professionals, first appear in church history? In Acts, the leadership seems to be laymen."

Dr. J. Vernon McGee: May I say to you, the matter of church government and the matter of a pastor or clergyman, as you call him, has always been a subject of discussion and controversy because actually that's not the important thing as far as the word of God is concerned. The Spirit of God did not clearly outline for us in this age exactly how a local church should function, that is the mechanics of it, that which has to do really with the organization.

The Spirit of God was more concerned with the character of the men that were to serve, and also more interested in the spiritual life of the believers. And when those that are leaders in a church are spiritually minded men, men that are filled with the Holy Spirit and the membership made up of spiritually minded people, then actually any system of government will work.

And down through the years there have arisen definitely three forms of government for the church. One is known as the episcopal form. It has to do with authority resting in someone at the top, and then gradations of authority as it goes down. You find that form of government today in the Methodist Church. Actually, the Roman Catholic Church is based on that system.

Then there is the extreme view the other way, and that is a congregational form of government where the membership vote on everything, and the church has deacons sometimes—sometimes they don't—but generally they do. The Baptist Church is characteristic of that type of a church, and generally the independent churches are more or less based on that, so-called Bible churches today. In between there is the form of government known as the Presbyterian or the representative form of government. And of course the Presbyterian Church is the classic example of that, and elders are elected that represent the congregation.

The place of the minister in all of these forms of government, of course, has been different because the form of government would determine his position in it. In the episcopal form of government, it's generally a minister or a preacher, or one who's ordained to the ministry that's up at the head. In the Presbyterian form, he's one of the elders. In the Baptist, well, he's more or less just the leader of the congregation.

Now for that reason, this opens up a great area of discussion, and there's been this gradual development down through the years of what you call the present-day clergyman. He is altogether different than Paul the Apostle or the early days of the church. And I think today that in many places that he is no longer considered the leader. There's sometimes some very dominant laymen that occupy that position.

And for that reason, this has been a gradual process down to the present hour. And it all goes back to the fact that the important thing in scripture was the character of the man, not an office. There was the office of elder which is clear in scripture, the office of deacon which is clear in scripture, and the office of a teacher and the office of a pastor, so that you have all of these in scripture. And they probably should function in the local church, but how are they to function?

Paul told Titus to appoint elders. Well, they weren't elected, they were appointed. But today even in the most reformed churches of all, why, the elders are elected. And that certainly wasn't the way it was done in the early church. But who would appoint them today? Titus is not around to do that, neither is Paul, so they drop back upon the way of electing them.

Now you say to me which form of government is scriptural? To tell the truth, I think any of them could be called scriptural provided the men that occupy these offices are the right kind of man—spiritually minded men. If it be otherwise, then I say to you that no form of government will work, and no form of government could be called scriptural. Therefore, you see the important thing is the man, not the office.

The average preacher today has become a do-it-yourself sort of individual that does all the jobs in the church that nobody else wants to do. And you find many ministers today that honestly are good teachers and good preachers; they are not given an opportunity to study as they should. One man that I know who's an outstanding preacher, a young man, has marvelous gifts. And he's in a church where they're working him to death and having him do other things which I personally think is rather tragic.

Guest (Male): On many occasions we receive letters from listeners who don't like the fact that we take up program time to read letters on the air. And since this can be a very sensitive issue, we thought it best for Dr. McGee to read one of those letters and then respond with our reasoning for using airtime to share with you the letters from our listeners. Here now is Dr. McGee.

Dr. J. Vernon McGee: Here is an example of the criticism that we get. This comes from Cincinnati, Ohio. It begins, "And now the most ludicrous excuse of all for begging via the reading of run-of-the-mill letters before the lesson. Unbelievable. Why not look to yourselves? Are you being good stewards of the money entrusted to you for getting out God's word?"

Well, let me answer this party first by saying that here is what you would call a run-of-the-mill letter. It comes from West Falls, New York. This party says, "My husband and I thought we were saved till you started pointing things out one after the other. Well, thanks to you and the saving grace of Jesus, our lives have started to change day by day. What we all need is a revelation of what we are instead of what we think we are."

May I say to you that we consider a letter like that remarkable, and therefore we feel that we are justified in reading letters. May I say to this party and any others, and I feel like they have a perfect right to express their feeling, their criticism. And I would add further that we feel justified in reading letters because there are many folk that write and say they think that oftentimes the reading of letters is more exciting and meaningful to them than the study itself.

There are others that write and say that the reading of letters has encouraged them. Others say that, "We thought we were alone in this feeling that we have, and now we find out that there are others. And we thought that this problem that this party's expressed is something that was just peculiar to us, and now we find out that your program has helped others." There have been those that have been saved by just the reading of the letters.

So we read letters because they are a result of the program itself. And friends who support the program, they are the people that need to be assured that the program is getting results. And that's the reason that many people support the program, is because that it is getting results. But we appreciate your letter and your expression. And we wish that we could please everybody. We learned long ago that you cannot.

But like the little sign in the restaurant that we saw in West Texas early one morning, the sign said, "You can't please everybody, but we try." And someone has sent to me three simple steps for avoiding criticism. The first one is say nothing, the second is do nothing, and the third is be nothing. Well, apparently since we're getting criticism, we recognize that we are reaching out. And therefore I do want to say that in behalf of our program, the reason that we today read letters, we shall continue to do it as we see they bring blessing to the hearts of many.

And they reveal to those who listen to the program that it is reaching out, touching hearts and lives, and getting results.

Guest (Male): From Los Angeles comes this question: "Could you please explain which James wrote the epistle by that name?"

Dr. J. Vernon McGee: Actually, in the scripture some very outstanding scholars have found four separate Jameses—that is, four men by the name of James. Now I personally have not been able to see quite that many, but I do see three separate individuals by the name of James. Now I have a book out, the title of it is *Briefing the Bible*. It has outlines and notes on every book of the Bible, and I deal in each one of these books with the author, the writer of the book.

And I want to turn to my note that I've made on the Epistle of James and read that to you. I trust it might be helpful to you. It'll certainly be self-explanatory. The problem of authorship is a major one of this epistle. Some find at least four men by the name of James in the New Testament; at least three are clearly identified.

First, James, brother of John, one of the sons of thunder. He was one of the sons of Zebedee and he was slain by Herod. And you'll find that in the 12th chapter of Acts, that is that he was slain in verses one and two. Now the second James, son of Alphaeus, called James the Less. He's mentioned in the list of the apostles, but very little is known concerning him. Now third, James, the Lord's brother.

And he's mentioned not by name, but you remember it mentions that the brothers of Jesus were among those that came to take him. He was in reality a half-brother according to the flesh, and he became head of the church at Jerusalem. And you'll find him mentioned in the 15th chapter of Acts, verse 13. And he is evidently the writer of this epistle, and he's the one that I'm confident Paul refers to over in Galatians 2:9 when he said he met yonder in Jerusalem with those that were pillars in the church.

Now it's my personal viewpoint that James the Less and the Lord's brother are probably the same, and I gather that from Galatians 1:19, but I would not want to push that. So I mention three Jameses. Now it was James, the Lord's brother, which means according to the flesh he was a half-brother, who is the writer of the Epistle of James.

Guest (Male): The same listener has a second question. She writes, "Why is Stephen called the first martyr when John the Baptist is martyred in Matthew chapter 14? Wouldn't John be considered the first martyr of the New Testament?"

Dr. J. Vernon McGee: That's true. You see, the first martyr not of the New Testament—if you put it in the terminology which you've given, the first martyr in the New Testament is John the Baptist, but that's not the way you put it. It's the first martyr of the church is Stephen. Now again you might want to say, "But wait a minute, John the Baptist is the first martyr of the church." No he's not.

John the Baptist is an Old Testament character. He's not actually a member of the church at all. He belongs to the Old Testament economy. You remember he made it very clear. He says, "The one who has the bride is the bridegroom." The bride is the church, and the bridegroom is Christ. "The one who has the bride is the bridegroom." Now he says, "But the friend of the bridegroom rejoices." He says, "I rejoice." He's the friend of the bridegroom. He's not either the bridegroom nor part of the bride. He just happens to be a friend, and he's not a member of the church, which is the body of Christ. John the Baptist absolutely is not.

You see, the church did not come into existence until the day of Pentecost. The church is built on the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. And you couldn't have a church until he died on the cross. You couldn't have a church until he rose again, and you couldn't have a church until he ascended into heaven, and you couldn't have a church until the day of Pentecost. So John the Baptist is not in the church. He therefore is not the first martyr of the church, but Stephen is the first martyr of the church.

But now in the New Testament, of course, John the Baptist is the first martyr there, unless you want to consider all those literally hundreds of little ones that were slain by Herod the Great.

Guest (Male): With that we come to the close of another fine Question and Answer program. If you'd like more information on any of these topics or others, then contact our offices for information about the many resources that we have available by Dr. McGee. Have you been riding on the Bible Bus with Dr. McGee? If not, then join us Monday through Friday on the Thru the Bible Radio program heard on this station.

Dr. McGee travels through the whole word of God in five years, book by book and chapter by chapter. Notes and outlines to be used to follow along with the study are provided when you ask for them. You can reach us at 1-800-65-BIBLE, Monday through Thursday, from 6:00 AM to 3:00 PM Pacific Time. Or by visiting our website at TTB.org or by writing to Questions and Answers. For those in the US, box 7-100, Pasadena, California, 91109. In Canada, box 25-325, London, Ontario, N6C 6B1. This program has been brought to you by the faithful friends and supporters of Thru the Bible Radio Network.