New Life LIVE

Brian Perez: Welcome to New Life LIVE. There are so many media choices available to you nowadays, but you’ve chosen to be with us, and you won’t be disappointed. I’m your host, Brian Perez, joined by a couple of ladies who really know their stuff and want to help you heal. Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist Dr. Jackie Mack Harris is here, as well as Doctor of Marriage and Family Therapy Sherry Denham Kepper. Sherry, how would you like to open the show today?

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: Yeah, I want to open it with a picture, kind of a parable. There was a traveler that was walking by and actually saw these large, full-grown elephants that had one of their legs tied to a stake. The traveler was confused. They were like, "Why are these huge elephants tied to these stakes in the ground?" I mean, honestly, they were like this is huge, tons of weight, and they easily could pull their foot out of that stake.

When he began to talk to the trainer that was there, the trainer told him that the elephants, when they were babies, actually had their legs tied to the stakes. Those baby elephants learned as they tried to pull away, they couldn’t. So because those baby elephants were there, day after day, year after year, to the same stake with their same ankle tied, they believed that they could not pull away. They could not break away. They could not be free.

What does that mean for us? I think there are a number of us that have grown up in circumstances, through no fault of our own, but circumstances where there were powerful controls, powerful chaos, powerful trauma events that were going on like alcoholism or parents that were fighting, domestic violence, sexual abuse, emotional abuse, psychological abuse. Things were going on and, like little elephants, we did not know and could not get out.

The fight, flight, freeze, or fold or fawn, those are different ways that trauma impacts us. So we felt powerless, helpless. We felt, "I can’t speak up. I can’t use my voice." We believed that I don’t matter. I’m insignificant. I’m unimportant.

So we get into these adult relationships, and there’s something that is coming our way, some harm that is happening. Somehow we go back, like those elephants, and believe that we’re powerless, helpless, that we don’t matter, that we don’t have power, that we don’t have freedom.

We may be held to this imaginary stake, yet it feels so real. It feels like it’s happening right now. So what do we have to do? We have to, one, identify the negative belief that’s coming up. We have to look at the rope around our ankle and say, "What is the belief about myself that is keeping me stuck in this place of flight or fright? Do I have learned helplessness?"

Begin to question, "Am I in learned helplessness, or is there a way of escape?" Then we need to get help. Reach out for help and assistance so we can have somebody look at us and go, "Actually, I see your ankle, and you have more capacity than you think you have."

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: Pick up your bed and walk. Pick up your mat and walk. That is exactly what I was thinking about. Jesus said, "Would you be well? Pick up your mat and walk."

Brian Perez: Great conversation so far today on New Life LIVE. If the first five minutes are any indication of how the rest of the show is going to go, it’s going to be good. Stick around.

Let’s go right to the phones, beginning with Julie in Monmouth, Oregon. Welcome to New Life LIVE, and thanks for listening to us on Sirius XM channel 131.

Guest (Julie): Hi, how are you today? I have a question. I was adopted at a young age, and I met my biological family when I was 35 years old. I did not have a connection with my biological mom. She’s just different. I just want to know, am I biblically wrong for not wanting a relationship with her?

Brian Perez: Is she biblically obligated to have a relationship with her biological mother? What do you say, Jackie?

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: I don’t think that you’re biblically obligated to do anything. I think that the Bible gives us opportunities to choose relationship. It gives us opportunities to choose reconciliation. The law of honoring your mother and father is important, and you have a mother and father who raised you.

I wonder if your reason for not wanting a relationship with your biological mom is that maybe there was something in that relationship, in that experience, that you didn’t feel safe. You’re trusting your body, your instinct, and I think you have every right to do that. Jesus came that we would be free. He didn’t come to do away with the law, but to fulfill it.

If you have accepted Christ, you’re good. Your salvation is intact. Now, in the natural, you have to do what is best in the day-to-day. God is giving you the wisdom and the insight and the knowledge to be able to make decisions. Your body is telling you that this is an unsafe place, this is an unsafe relationship. You have an obligation to listen to that.

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: So when you say you have an obligation to listen to this being unsafe, it means she can honor her body. She can decide that it’s not what she needs to do.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: Because God created these bodies. We’re created in his image. There are these signals that as children in some families we grow up being taught to ignore and being taught that they are bad. Even in some religious experiences, we are being taught to self-abandon and do what this external force or source tells us.

But scripture says that God walks with me. My steps are ordered by God, not by man. So God is ordering my steps. I’m going to seek counsel from God. God, this relationship feels off. I feel something in my body. What are you calling me to do? As long as I don’t get a concrete, "Here’s why you need to go be with this person," and a push that makes me not be able to help going to see them, if I don’t get that, then I trust that God is saying I’m good right where I am.

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: Permission to not. I have one question for Julie. Julie, I am wondering what is the external force that is causing you to believe that you may need to reconnect with your biological mom? What happened right before you called us? Like, what’s going on that you would call us today? We’re glad you did, but I’m so curious about why now?

Guest (Julie): So my family’s always on me. My own kids are like, "Why don’t I give her a chance?" Because the background is she was born normal, then something happened to her that was out of her control. I think she was eight or nine and she caused brain damage, which is not her fault. So they all think I’m not a very compassionate Christian because I’m not that way. I’ve tried with her, but I can’t relate with her. I’ve never been around people like that too much.

That sounds so bad. It’s not all what it is. She’s controlling. I got into it recently with her because one of my cousins was joking around with me and she tried to get in between and protect me and she threatened me. First, I started off nice saying, "Look, you don’t need to do that because I can handle this because we’re just joking around." Then it caused a big rift because she feels like she has to be a mom but she doesn’t know how because her mind’s like an eight-year-old. You obviously know how to be a parent. So it causes a problem with my entire family. They all think I’m not a good Christian.

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: Wow. Well, Julie, my goodness. It makes so much sense when we hear your story. It’s exactly what Dr. Jackie said. It’s not that you have never met your mom; it’s the opposite. Your mom has a permanent disability. She has developmental brain damage delay. So she’s functioning like a younger person, like a younger child. How confusing that must be for you to have this person be your biological parent but have them moving in a capacity that, because of the brain damage, is way less mature than you.

This is a thing. There’s judgment around you. People are judging you saying, "Well, you just need to give her a chance." But let me say this: nobody other than you knows what it feels like to be adopted, knows what it feels like to have another family that’s raised you. No one can actually be in your shoes other than you.

So I’m in agreement with what Dr. Jackie said. You know who she is. It’s about getting safe, and she doesn’t sound safe. She doesn’t sound stable because of her brain issues, and it just creates more chaos in your world. So maybe there needs to be some language around how to tell those family members, your kids, or others what your reality is.

Language that might sound something like, "I hear what you’re saying. You think I should give my mom a chance. It’s very sad, but my mom’s brain damage, that developmental delay, makes my mom more like a child. I am not here to be her parent. I’m here to be your parent to your kids. I’m here to be your parent, and I’ve got parents that raised me. So my heart, I can focus in on those parents and I can focus in on you and I can love my mom, my biological mom, but I can just love her from a distance. That’s what I need to do."

Having some clear boundaries, being able to communicate that to help people step back from their unrealistic expectations. Sometimes we need to put boundaries down with our words so people will back up and realize your guilt manipulation and pushing me is not going to go anywhere.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: I love that you said that because that guilt and manipulation and the pushing that they’re doing because of their own discomfort is them trying to use you to make themselves feel better. This is somebody’s grandmother, somebody’s sister, auntie. Are they having relationship with her? If so, great, they get to do that. But their expectation that you’re going to move differently in relationship with her is just their expectation, and you don’t have to do anything with that.

You haven’t dishonored her. It sounds like you’ve met her and they’re fine, but just not your cup of tea, and that’s absolutely fine. You’re not responsible for her, and you’re not responsible for everyone else’s feelings and their ideas about you being a good Christian or a bad Christian. It sounds very limited. If you really believe that my faith and my Christianity is tied to me being in relationship with a person, then you don’t understand what it means to have a relationship with Jesus. Because your faith is tied to Jesus. Your faith is not tied to your biological mother. You have to walk that walk on your own. Don’t let anyone else muddy it up for you.

Brian Perez: Julie, thanks for your phone call today here on New Life LIVE. Now we’re going to Sue in Dallas, Texas, who is listening to us on the New Life app. Thank you for calling in today, Sue. How can we help you?

Guest (Sue): Hi. This is probably my sixth or seventh call to you in several years. We’ll call you a frequent flyer. How’s that? We love that, Sue, because then we build a relationship with you along the way. I think I’ve actually talked to you, Sherry, one time about my own healed broken PTSD, whatever you call it.

It was a journey. I’m 83, and I’m calling today for my granddaughter who is 11. She has had a lot of different blows from the beginning before she was even born, and I don’t know how much detail you need, but I will tell you the major presenting situation from over a year ago. She was just turning 10 when this all transpired, and she got the norovirus. She had no knowledge of vomiting until this incident happened, and it did something dramatic to her, we think.

At the same time, her father and his new family were moving back to the area where we live after being gone three years. That was his choice because of work and things when she was probably about seven, I think it was. So she had that change back.

She has had severe anxiety. This little girl is a very devout Christian. She really has the Lord. A lot of little kids don’t, but she was taught pretty well, and she still clings to him even though she’s feeling terrible. So what transpired after this sickness that just freaked her right out—and her mom and stepdad had it too, so she knew it wasn’t just her—right after that, she started developing fear of being away from her mom to the point where she was going to school and acting out physically, like throwing herself on the ground, crying, not wanting to go, not wanting to leave her mother’s side. She expressed only a few times that she wished her dad and mom were still married.

Main question is: she was given by a Christian psychiatrist a small dose of Prozac when she started. I’ve been an educator for years and I’ve worked special needs, so I was very nervous about this. I know it was the only drug approved for children. I want to know what your theories are. She is off it now; she has titrated down after a year. She is still very anxious. One example of how she reacts: she came to me one day and she had a little drink she got from Starbucks that had little seeds in it. She asked, "Grandma, will I be okay? This won’t hurt me? Will I be okay? Will I live? Will I be okay?" She won’t take Benadryl because she’s afraid it might be poison.

Brian Perez: We’ve got to go to break, Sue. Thanks for calling in today. We’ll hear what Doctors Jackie Mack Harris and Sherry Denham Kepper have to say about your situation.

Jackie and Sherry, what would you say to Sue?

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: Well, Sue, it made me wonder if there was maybe a family history of mental illness that this virus kind of unlocked. But it sounds like she needs some more intensive help to help her navigate this new fear that the virus unlocked. This fear of illness, of sickness, of death is probably a direct reaction to the illness that she had, and it’s going to take some psychological work over time. So I would recommend a Christian counselor.

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: I have a specific type of counseling that I would recommend. When I think about this virus—and I just know somebody that their daughter had it, they ended up in the ER this week—it is so insane. If a kid has never experienced that feeling of loss of control when you’re vomiting, I hate it. I will do whatever I need to do to not throw up. It’s because I can’t breathe, I feel scared, I feel out of control. We sit with bellyaches, but in that type of virus, no control.

Now, according to the trauma world and doing the EMDR, which is Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing, a negative belief that could get wired in at that time when she was 10 and the virus is "I’m not in control." It’s either that or "I am in danger." It’s one of those most likely.

So that’s the negative belief that the brain wires in in order to try to protect your granddaughter. Well, guess what else happens? Her parents split. She’s wishing they were together. What might the brain have wired in? "I’m not in control," because I can’t control what my parents are doing. Somehow when she’s looking at seeds in the Starbucks cup, when she’s drinking something, her body memory, the body memory of what goes in her mouth, what comes out of it, she’s got anxiety.

I would have her do EMDR because I find that there can be five or six sessions that are focused in on that virus that she got that can help her body get up to speed with she’s not there anymore and that actually she lived through it and can help to peel back some of the catastrophizing, some of the fear about what she’s ingesting to help her find her peace and calm again. So stay on the line and we can see about finding a therapist in your area. But emdria.org is the national website, and you want to find someone there that’s a consultant or certified, maybe one that even works with children.

Brian Perez: Sue, thanks for calling us today. We’ve also got a couple of resources. There’s an article at newlife.com. We’re going to put a link to it in the show notes: "Eight Tips to Stop Anxiety Dead in its Tracks." Maybe you can read this over with her and help her. Next time you’re feeling anxious, just do these exercises. Also, "Six Tools to Ease Anxiety." That’s a tip sheet that we can send you when you call us at 1-800-NEW-LIFE.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: For the parenting perspective, I would recommend "How We Love Our Kids" just to help the parents and Sue talk to her about it. Give them a tool, the comfort circle, to be able to open up and talk and keep the focus on her rather than lecturing her.

Brian Perez: "How We Love Our Kids," that’s a book that’s available in the newlife.com store. Daniel in Las Vegas, welcome to New Life LIVE.

Guest (Daniel): Thank you for your program. I was just at me and getting opinion on marriage. I’ve been married for over 43 years. Never really felt like I’ve been loved and always trying to please and never felt that even from when I dated. Then I started drinking and everything, and she’s not much of a drinker or nothing, but I know they had a family history of anger. A bunch of things went through our family.

Now I’m just learning, you know, just I can’t please somebody or you can’t make somebody love you. And it’s always been, "Oh, you’re the alcoholic," or you’re this, or you know, I am. But I mean, I might be, but I’m not probably a very good person. But I like people. I’m a people person. And it just seems like when we used to go out, because I had a business, we’d go out and stuff and, you know, just for like meeting with the higher ups, she’d go, "Well, I’m finished eating, take me home." I’d go, "Well, I’m here, that’s rude." She goes, "Well, you could come back." Then everything was like you take her dancing or something like that, "I don’t want to dance." If someone asks me to dance, then she gets upset.

Brian Perez: So what’s your main question for us today, Daniel?

Guest (Daniel): The marriage. What would you guys recommend?

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: We recommend the Intimacy in Marriage weekend. I think that they need that kind of intensive help to be able to walk through and maybe change some dynamics.

Brian Perez: Intimacy in Marriage is a weekend workshop that we offer throughout the year. You can get all the details about it at newlife.com. The two of you just go and sit there with other couples for three days and you’ll get some wise counsel. You’ll learn about the comfort circle that we spoke about a few minutes ago. It would be very helpful to you.

Becky Brown: Hello, it’s Becky Brown, and I am so excited to launch our 99 for the One partner initiative. Every day we hear from people all over the world who are looking for hope. They’ve been lost in a relationship struggle, addiction, anxiety, depression, all kinds of ways. It reminds us of the story in Luke 15 where the shepherd leaves the 99 to go rescue the one.

We’ve seen God work in the lives of so many people over the years here at New Life, and we want to invite you to be part of what God is doing. 99 for the One is our partner program that you can give to the ministry on a monthly basis to make sure that we continue to reach out to the lost. Call 1-800-NEW-LIFE, 1-800-639-5433, or newlife.com/99for1.

Brian Perez: Daniel, Jackie recommended Intimacy in Marriage.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: I think that that would be incredibly helpful. So when it comes back around again, encourage your wife to go. If you need help with that, you can talk to someone here at New Life. Also read the book "How We Love." It will teach you how to do the comfort circle. It will also teach you about yourself. You mentioned being a pleaser and feeling like you’d never felt like you were loved.

Sometimes people don’t know what that feels like. So if you don’t know what it means to be loved, if you don’t have a frame of reference for that based on your childhood, there’s some expectation you’re expecting to feel and you haven’t got that. So it says, "I haven’t felt loved. She hasn’t loved me. She hasn’t made you feel like you are enough," and no one can do that if you don’t feel like you’re enough on your own. So I would read "How We Love" and learn more about yourself and use that communication tool.

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: There’s just one thought, Daniel. Sometimes we have blind spots. I think we all have blind spots. I know you love people, and I’m wondering how much with your alcohol addiction, your love of people, probably a guy that comes into a room and gets conversations going, you might be fun. Your wife might feel like you’ve not really heard her. Like there’s a lot of energy that swirls around you, and you may be in a place of not being as curious as to how she felt invisible in your marriage because of your drinking. Those areas haven’t been repaired.

So no matter where you’re at in your phase of recovery, it’s not like there’s just a button you can press and now all of a sudden she’s just on again when the alcohol replaced her for a period of time. So that’s why I think for you guys to come together, unpack it, take a look at where her hurts are and why she shuts down. She’s probably been shut down for a while. So if you’re serious about the marriage, you’re going to have to be serious about pursuing her heart and finding out where she felt invisible and left behind.

Brian Perez: Intimacy in Marriage, the weekend workshop, also the book "How We Love." You can find information about both on our website, newlife.com. Jason in Phoenix, Arizona, listening on Sirius XM channel 131. You’re next up. How can we help you today, Jason?

Guest (Jason): Good morning to all of you. Thank you for this program. So I’ve also been trying to listen and learn what’s important for you guys. What is the question? I tried to write it down as best as possible. I just have so much going on, and I’m so grateful that I have this outlet with you guys today. But how do I get over feeling lost or less than or constantly feeling judged?

Brian Perez: What’s the story?

Guest (Jason): I was trying to think of a bunch of different things as I’ve been listening to the different callers and trying to go back to my childhood.

Brian Perez: We’ll do that part for you. We just want to know what your main question is and then maybe we’ll have some follow-ups.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: What happened that made you be in this state?

Guest (Jason): Well, I just lost my mom in October.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: Deep grief. That’s a huge loss.

Guest (Jason): Being an only child and lost my dad in 2001 already to diabetes.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: Have you done any therapy since your mom died? Have you done grief work?

Guest (Jason): No.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: There’s some help for you. This is something that you need support to walk through. You said you’re an only child and both of your parents have passed. I hope that you have aunties and uncles around supporting you, possibly grandparents. I hope that you have some people in your life that are very close to you that love you.

But what I think you need is to do some work and grieve. In that work, you can walk back through because sometimes it’s a struggle when we’re grieving the loss of our parents because sometimes childhood was great and we can’t believe they’re gone and how we’re going to make it on our own. Sometimes childhood was rocky, and there are some things we still need to forgive, and it can be confusing and you can feel lost. So finding a good counselor that can walk through this with you, I think, is the way to go.

Brian Perez: Jason, you kind of chuckled when Jackie asked you if you’ve done grief work. What were you thinking?

Guest (Jason): Just that I’m constantly consumed with so many things in life right now, and it’s a lot of stress. It just seems like all I’ve dealt with is loss in my life. I’m constantly stressed, constantly focusing on what I don’t have, what I’m not.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: You said it right there. You’re focused on loss because you’ve had so much loss, and you’re focused on what you don’t have, that you’re not enough, what you’re not achieving. Working with a counselor to help you get through the grief, because we feel grief when we lose a job, a house, we move. Sometimes we feel grief even when it’s something good. We get a new job or promotion, but we’ve left that department, and so we grieve that.

So you really do need to do some grief work and then also work through that part of knowing who you are. Instead of spending so much energy on what you aren’t or what you don’t have, start to live in gratitude daily. "What am I grateful for?" If you can start to add that ritual of gratitude daily, you might be able to shift your brain, but also do some work with a counselor.

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: Hey, Jason. Do you feel emotionally abandoned right now? Actually, do you feel emotionally orphaned? It’s a different word.

Guest (Jason): Throughout the years, my mom has always said for me to never bother her family. Unfortunately, I’ve just been through a lot of nonsense in my life where my mom was there to help me financially. Just a whole string of things as I constantly look back on my life of what I didn’t do right or what I lost.

Even just this biggest example in my face is that I got to spend two weeks with my mom before she passed. A couple times she just said to me, "You get nothing," and "I’m so sorry." She was very apologetic those last two weeks. Then out of nowhere, like a month ago, I got a call from one of her older sisters that does live here in Phoenix. She said, "Your mom left you money." It was a good chunk.

Well, unfortunately, my wife and our two kids, we’ve been in a lot of hardship. We just came out of being homeless a second time, and so that money was gone in a day because we tried to play catch up on so much that we’ve just been behind on. So I have these aunts in Phoenix Arizona, and the different phone calls in these past months have just been judgmental. "What you’ve had your chances, you could have been doing this, you could have been doing that." Money is a huge thing. Of course, it makes me feel like garbage, it makes me feel less than, like I’ve never been able to handle my own. But I’m 55. I’ve been through a lot of years of where I have done on my own. I’ve been in the Navy.

They ridicule me of what I have not done or who that I am not.

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: And they don’t even know you. I mean, think about this, Jason. They don’t even know you, but they’re judging you. It’s almost like your mom was trying to protect you from their judgment. But you know what you need right now more than anything? I think you need nurture. I think you need nurture and some acceptance, and you need someone to sit down with you and help you get clarity around your life, your capacity. You’ve served your country, and I just wonder if you’ve been running for a long time and this death of your mom is finally opening up an opportunity for you to stop and feel and sort through things.

Brian Perez: Jason, we have a book recommendation for you from the newlife.com store. It’s called "Take Your Life Back." So check that out. We can connect you with faith-based Christian counseling and biblical life coaching across the country because some problems need more than a quick answer; they need a guide. Whether you’re facing addiction, anxiety, marriage and family issues, or you just feel stuck, New Life’s network of licensed counselors and trained coaches will walk with you toward healing and God’s best for your life.

Take the next step. Go to newlife.com, click counseling and coaching. Let’s go to Dorothy in Los Angeles who just found out about New Life LIVE. Welcome. How can we help you, Dorothy?

Guest (Dorothy): Hi. It’s my first time calling. I just heard about it. I’m calling because I have a crystal meth addiction. For a long time, I didn’t know that I was doing what Satan wanted me to do. I was demonic and I didn’t know it. I was going to church thinking that I was there to praise God, and I wasn’t doing that. I was actually really condescendingly going to church doing that. Anyways, today God was telling me that he’s condemning me to hell. So that really scared me, so it made me stop and realize what I was doing. Now I just pray that you guys can pray for me that that doesn’t actually happen.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: I’m going to read something to you. When you get a chance, I want you to go read it. This is Romans chapter 7, starting at verse 21. "I have discovered this principle of life: that when I want to do what is right, I inevitably do what is wrong. I love God’s law with all my heart. But there is another power within me that is at war with my mind. This power makes me a slave to sin that is still within me. Oh, what a miserable person I am! Who will free me from this life that is dominated by sin and death? Thank God! The answer is in Jesus Christ our Lord. So you see how it is. In my mind, I really want to obey God’s law, but because of my sinful nature, I am a slave to sin."

Then we roll into Romans chapter 8, and it starts with: "So now there is no condemnation for those who belong to Christ Jesus. And because you belong to him, the power of the life-giving Spirit has freed you from the power of sin that leads to death."

So I want you to reread that at your leisure over and over and over again. Memorize it and meditate on those words. Because if you accept Christ, then your life begins to change. You said you kind of were going condescendingly. Maybe you really don’t know Jesus. Maybe you haven’t truly accepted Christ and because of that, you’ve felt off and felt like you’re playing with God. Go back and read those scriptures and then read all of Romans and walk your way through accepting Christ. Do you have a church?

Guest (Dorothy): I go to a Seventh Day Adventist Church.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: When you are with your church, you might find a mentor that you can talk with. Are you in treatment?

Guest (Dorothy): No, I’m not yet anyways.

Dr. Jackie Mack Harris: Maybe we can help you find a counselor and a treatment center. So stay on the line.

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: Dorothy, I want to mention one thing to you. Do you know that I have spent time with other folks that have addictions like crystal meth and other types of things that they’re taking? I want to tell you something. When somebody is using crystal meth, what they don’t realize is it begins to impact a part of their brain that’s called the temporal lobes. It’s these two little parts of your brain that are at the bottom of your brain. What does it do? Crystal meth is toxic on your brain.

When that starts impacting your brain, people begin to have spiritual thoughts that aren’t true. They begin to hear things about God that aren’t true because those temporal lobes have to do with spiritual auditory distortions and all of that. So I think that the crystal meth is actually—like you’ve taken enough of it that your brain is starting to be compromised. I think you’d do very well by getting into treatment. I think you’d do very well by getting into a 12-step NA group, starting to deal with this crystal meth and the impact on your brain. As you become sober and you start stopping the crystal meth, feelings that are good about God will return. I honestly have seen it over and over and over again at other drug and rehab centers. That’s what I think is going on. The crystal meth isn’t good for your brain, sweet one, and I want you to be able to have your temporal lobes back.

Brian Perez: What do you think of what you’ve just heard, Dorothy?

Guest (Dorothy): I think that she is right because I’ve been through something like this before, just in a different way. I was going to say I think God may do that to you so you get scared enough to get help.

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: True. But your temporal lobes, when they’re compromised, you’re going to hear stuff like "you’re condemned to hell." That’s not God. That’s your brain on crystal meth telling you something that isn’t true. Girl, will you do me a favor? Will you make a phone call to get in and start getting some rehab? Because I love your brain and I want you to have it working well. But you’ve got to start getting off the crystal meth. It’s not good for your temporal lobes. All right?

Guest (Dorothy): I’m scared too. Thank you.

Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper: It’s very scary. It’s very scary, but call. It may be scary to be sober. I imagine it’s also scary to have a voice in your mind telling you that you’re condemned to hell. So let’s pick our hard and pick the hard of getting healthy so that that voice that’s condemning you to hell goes away.

Brian Perez: Dorothy, stay on the phone because we’re going to try to help you get connected with somebody there in your area. You’re in Los Angeles. I know there will be lots of treatment that we can assist you with there in L.A. It’s so amazing to watch a brain get sober and to watch a human being come back online to who they were before the drug of their choice started robbing their brain of its faculties. It’s kind of scary when you first see it because family members think, "I’m losing that person." But actually, your brain is in a constant state of wanting to repair. So as soon as those drugs get peeled off, the toxic drugs, crystal meth, other types of drugs that compromise brain use, the brain’s already wanting to repair, to be healthier, and that person comes back online and then they aren’t thinking those thoughts anymore.

And that passage was Romans 7 starting at verse 21 and finished that chapter out, and then the first verse of Romans chapter 8.

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