New Life LIVE

Brian Perez: Welcome to the New Life LIVE podcast. We hope to provide help and hope in your life through God's word, counselors, and psychologists as we answer questions from listeners who call with the challenges of life. Let's go to today's episode.

Hey everyone, welcome to New Life LIVE. I'm your host, Brian Perez, and we're going to be in the studio for two hours today. So, start calling in now. 1-800-229-3000 is our number. Here to answer your questions, we've got parenting expert Dr. Jim Burns. He's the founder of Homeward. We've also got licensed marriage and family therapist Mark Cameron. You guys can call about anything: parenting, marriage, addiction, grief, depression, so much. 1-800-229-3000. Welcome, guys. Mark, what's on your mind to start us off?

Mark Cameron: Well, this time last year, my wife and I took a trip to England. I literally invited her to take a walk down memory lane with me. I took her back to the neighborhood in London where I grew up. It had been about 30 years since I had gone back, and it was quite a surreal experience.

Now, I know most movies depict England with stately houses and prestigious schools, but that wasn't my childhood growing up. I grew up in inner-city London during the '80s and the '90s. We lived in government housing. It was a place where there were drugs, violence, and occasionally even murders.

A lot has changed since I lived there, but as I walked those streets again and I pointed out to my wife significant areas where things happened to me, I realized just how much anxiety I lived with as a kid. My nervous system got trained to constantly scan my surroundings, anticipating what might come next.

This is what struck me here: Many people try and convince themselves, "Well, that was then, this is now. I made it through. It doesn't bother me anymore. It doesn't affect me anymore." We somehow think that time erases the impact of the past.

But it's a huge lie that time heals all wounds. It does not because the brain doesn't work that way. The part of our brain that stores traumatic or overwhelming experiences does not perceive time. It simply just codes emotion and physical sensation to that experience and then creates associations for us to be on the lookout for that danger again. Then, when we see those associations, it activates our nervous system, and that's what we call a trigger.

Even though I left England decades ago and moved halfway across the world, that young boy came with me. His fears, his strategies, and his anxious reactions followed me into adulthood and impacted my relationships, especially my marriage.

Here's the good news about attachment research: It's not just what happened to you that predicts your level of being able to grow. It's how you've come to make sense of that experience. It's what researchers call developing a coherent narrative. It's a story of your life that is honest, integrated, and makes sense of the pain.

That's why healthy relationships are more about sharing the good times, vacations, funny stories, and enjoyable activities. It's easy to feel close to someone during the good times, but intimacy often grows when we can share the painful parts of our story with someone.

When we risk saying, "Here's what happened to me and here's how it shaped me," and then when somebody responds not with a quick fix, but with comfort, care, and compassion, our brain actually starts to recall the memory in a new way, and the trigger loses its power.

My wife and I have been practicing this together more intentionally recently. Instead of just talking about the problem that's going on and trying to solve that, we're learning to listen to one another, to hear about childhood wounds that still influence us today. It's been really cool just to hear different stories and develop that compassion and understanding.

So, here's a question to think about today: What's the part of your life that you've been hoping was left behind, but you know that you're still carrying with you today? Maybe today's the day to begin telling that story in a safe place so you can finally heal. If this is resonating with you, give us a call. Tell us some of your story. Tell us what's going on today and let us help you make some links to how some of your past experiences might be impacting the present.

Brian Perez: For some people, this might be their safe place because they're afraid to tell anyone about what they've gone through in their childhood or what they're going through now. So give us a call. We can connect you with the right people at 1-800-229-3000. A couple of right people are here right now. Jim and Mark, talking to you next.

To find out more information about New Life or to order any of the resources mentioned on today's program, call 1-800-NEW-LIFE. Now back to New Life LIVE.

One of the things Mark was talking about right now was the importance of understanding your attachment style, and he's written a book about it. You can pick it up in the newlife.com store. It's called "Understanding Your Attachment Style." Dr. Jim, what did you think of what Mark said?

Jim Burns: For one thing, as soon as he was done and we went to a break, we knuckle-bumped because I thought we have to make sure that we're in touch with our past in order to be better in the future.

Kathy and I both came from dysfunctional families, and we made a commitment in our marriage a year into the marriage to be what we call the transitional generation. The Bible says that you inherit the sins of a previous generation, to the third and fourth generations, all throughout the Old Testament.

But we put a stake in the ground and said we're either going to recover or repeat. What Mark said was so profound because we don't have to repeat how we grew up or those kinds of experiences. We do have to be in touch with them, but we can recover. I think that's partly what New Life is all about. That's what this program is all about. People call in and they say, "I don't want to keep repeating this. How do I recover?" There are answers for that.

As Mark was talking about attachment style, when I learned to embrace my differences with Kathy—and we have differences—I think the marriage got better because we began to understand that she's going to live this way and I'm going to live this way. It doesn't mean that everything is right or good; it means that we work through that process.

So you either recover or repeat. I just want to say to somebody who heard what he said, I almost teared up thinking about how he's this amazing man now who's incredible, and going through that process would be so scary and traumatic. I thought about other listeners who have had a similar situation, and they don't have to stay stuck, but they do have to do the work to get to some freedom.

Brian Perez: Would it be easier if there was just some machine we can go into and it just wipes out all those bad memories and only keeps the good ones?

Jim Burns: There would be the longest line! Exactly. It's not a machine, but when I became a Christian, my faith in Jesus and the forgiveness of Christ, that did change me. I surely carry some of those bad habits and some of those other things with me, but that was the transforming part.

I see people who make that commitment. It doesn't change the way they look, it doesn't change what they wear, and it doesn't change all the relationships around them, but it transforms them in a way that nothing else can do.

Brian Perez: Perhaps one of the things that's keeping people from calling us here at New Life LIVE at 1-800-229-3000 is because they think, "I don't want to do therapy or counseling because I have to start digging in the past and bringing up those old memories." But that's happening anyway, right?

Mark Cameron: Exactly. We have two types of memories. We have explicit memories, which is what you're talking about people being afraid to do: "I don't want to think about it." Then we have implicit memories, meaning that they're bodily feeling memories.

So we are thinking about it, we are recalling it, but we're not thinking about it on a conscious level. We recall it, and that's exactly what I was talking about and how the brain tags those experiences and creates associations and then triggers.

If you're repeating patterns in your life and you can see the patterns—and we're pattern people—there's something there that needs to be looked at and overcome. When you learn to do that, a wonderful thing happens: the brain integrates that memory and then it learns to file it differently and recall it without the trigger.

Jim Burns: That's a great thought, that it can happen and it does happen. We just have to make sure that we're working on it or else it leaks out. If we don't deal with it, then it just leaks out of our body. it leaks out the way we treat people and leaks out the way we allow people to treat us.

We don't want that. We can be better. We can do it in a more effective way, and that's why we need the people around us who can help give good and wise advice. My pastor yesterday just killed it. I loved his sermon. I walked out a better person because I went to church on Sunday. I honestly think that when we're listening to good wisdom and good insight, how much of that do we do, and how much of it do we just scroll and look at funny memes of cats eating weird food?

Brian Perez: 1-800-229-3000 is our number and let's go to the phones now, beginning with Lynn. Lynn in Denver, Colorado, listening on newlife.com. Thank you so much for calling us today. You're on with Dr. Jim Burns and Mark Cameron.

Lynn: Hi, thank you so much for taking my call. I am just coming out of a divorce from an abusive marriage. He's a pastor in the area. He was heavily involved in the community, and when we divorced, he had hidden the abuse so well and I had covered for him so well that no one believes what he's done. How can I make connections in a community where I'm scorned and I have been told not to come to churches because they believe him?

Brian Perez: Any churches? Not just the ones where he pastored?

Lynn: Well, there was three to four churches. Three where the pastor actually told me and one where the deacons told me. They didn't want me in their church and said that I had a Jezebel spirit. It's been over a year since the divorce, almost two, and I'm just trying to heal.

Brian Perez: What would you guys say?

Mark Cameron: Well, Lynn, I'm so sorry that's happened. Whenever there's abuse, there's typically gaslighting where the abuser blames the victim and tells them it's their fault. It sounds like that's continuing to happen to you. Even though you got out of this abusive relationship, it's happening to you from the wider community. It's likely exacerbating all of those experiences that you had.

This is really difficult because we know that this happens. We know prominent people, prominent public figures, they are not perfect. They can be abusive and it's hard to believe.

Here's what I would say: I would say that you need to find a safe space. There are groups out there, especially for women who have been abused. So I would try to look for one of those resources. We have recovery groups out there too. I'd also get into therapy. Have you started therapy yet for your recovery?

Lynn: I did with one therapist in the area, and she had been so influenced by him that she was telling me things that I knew were not true. She said I was hearing voices. I am not hearing voices. If you could have seen the way that he acted in the final days of our marriage, he was mumbling to himself under his breath and talking to thin air. Everything that he did to me and everything that I witnessed, he told others that I was doing. He reversed it.

Mark Cameron: Yeah, there's an acronym for that. It's called DARVO, and it stands for Deny, Attack, Reverse the Victim Offender order. It's something that's very typical of what an abuser would do. They do it just to make you feel crazy as the victim, and they also do it to cloud things with people around. If both people are saying the same thing, then others find it difficult to judge who's right and who's wrong here.

It's a common tactic, but I believe you, Lynn. If there's anyone, especially a professional therapist, who's making you feel that way, I would end therapy right away. Look for somebody who is specifically trained in working with clients who are recovering from abuse and maybe even specifically trained with working with women who are recovering from abuse. You're more likely to find somebody who will understand these tactics, who will empathize with you, and who will be able to walk you through that recovery process.

Brian Perez: So not only is it difficult for you to find a new church, but you can't even find a therapist because the waters have been muddied. Jim, what are your thoughts?

Jim Burns: Well again, I echo what Mark said, Lynn. I'm so sorry. I live in this world of ministry where I see sometimes pastors do what your husband has done and how he acts one way to you and then another way up front.

That's a real issue, and I'm so sorry that other churches, which should be a safe place for you, have spoken to you in the way that they have. That's unfair. I would suggest very practically: One is, yes, you've got to find somebody who can be safe. There are counselors who are going to be safe. I can think of 10 right now where I live who, if you went to them, they would not play what that woman did.

So go out of that circle. For example, the other thing...

Brian Perez: Maybe an online counseling?

Jim Burns: Yeah, you could do online counseling, sure. But somebody who understands it and who doesn't know your husband, who's not influenced by him in one way or another, and doesn't even know who he is. In your little world, they all may know him, but the world doesn't know him.

Secondly, I would go to a church and let's say you hear about a church or maybe you just kind of sneak in and watch it and experience it. You go, "This is a good place." I would then meet with the pastor or some leaders in the church and just say, "Hey, here's my situation. I'm looking for a safe place. How do you feel about me being here?" because you need a place that's going to be welcoming to you and who's going to be your church, not a church that he's either influenced or has some kind of an input.

That's what I would do. I would find a because there are good churches out there and there are good churches that are going to care for you and love you and I would keep looking in that direction because not all pastors and churches act like the ones you've been a part of. It's just really sad to say that you got stuck in that.

Safety, and then do what Mark said. Find a counselor who totally gets where you're coming from and who has no prejudice toward a husband of yours, ex-husband, and do the work that you need. I'm thinking of even one of our therapists here who's on New Life LIVE, and she wrote a book called "Intimate Deception." She was married to a pastor and that pastor was kind of a serial adulterer. She has used that brokenness without a lot of defensiveness about the church or bitterness and resentment. She had to go through some of that, I would imagine you do too, to really help thousands of people. So there is a place for you. There is a place for you in the church. There is a place for you with counseling and that's going to be your ticket to health.

Lynn: I won't be able to move out of the area for another year, and I know it'll get better once I leave and I move. I praise God that I never lost faith in God. I never lost faith in the Lord taking care of me and being there for me and loving me, but it has taken such a toll on my self-esteem.

Jim Burns: No, I get it. I get it. I'm so sorry. But even where you live, you're in Denver, I mean, there's loads of people and there's loads of great churches who may not know your husband. Even for this first year, you may move and that isn't the world's worst idea sometimes depending on what your life situation is.

But you may get great help from a place where you weren't thinking about it. Keep looking for it but be careful and guard your heart. The Bible says guard your heart above all else for it determines the course of your life and so you've got to make sure that you're guarding your heart when you go to these places because you kind of are getting ripped off a little bit by these places saying we don't want you here. That's horrible.

Hang on the phone, Lynn, because we can put you in touch not only with a group but with a counselor too.

Brian Perez: Was infidelity part of the story too?

Lynn: There was a lot of infidelity, in so much that I could not go to the domestic violence shelter for women because he was seeing a woman who worked there.

Brian Perez: Man. The reason I asked that question and Dr. Jim mentioned the book, it's called "Intimate Deception." It's by Dr. Sheri Keffer. She was on the show recently and it's in our store, newlife.com, so check out that book.

We've also got an online gathering coming up. It's called Rescue. I'll tell you about that when we come back from the break because we are coming up to the break, but also Lynn, stay on the phone because we want to put you in touch with somebody there in your area or like we said, maybe it's online that we do for you. Thanks for calling today to 1-800-229-3000 and Jean, we'll talk to you when we come back too.

To find out more information about New Life or to order any of the resources mentioned on today's program, call 1-800-NEW-LIFE. Now back to New Life LIVE.

1-800-229-3000 is the number to call us today and if you, like our previous caller Lynn, have experienced infidelity in your marriage through your husband's part, we have an online gathering coming up in just a few weeks. It's called Rescue: Your First Step Toward Healing. It's happening on August 1st. Early bird pricing ends this Friday, July 17th.

If you've experienced betrayal in your marriage, you know the pain goes far beyond what most people can see: the confusion, the fear, the loneliness, the constant questions. Many women find themselves wondering if they're overreacting or if they'll ever feel safe again. That's why New Life created Rescue: Your First Step Toward Healing.

It's Saturday, August 1st. Licensed counselor Laura Mangin McDonald will lead this special online experience designed specifically for women impacted by betrayal. Laura not only specializes in betrayal trauma professionally, she's also walked this journey personally. It's a four-hour event and you'll hear practical teaching, participate in supportive small group discussions, and learn how to begin finding stability, safety, and hope again. Perhaps most importantly, you'll discover you're not alone. If you're ready to take a step toward healing, visit newlife.com and learn more about Rescue today. Again, it's happening Saturday, August 1st. Early bird pricing ends this Friday.

1-800-229-3000 is our number and let's talk to Jean, who is in Washington DC, listening on WAVA. Hi there, Jean. Welcome to New Life LIVE. You're on with Mark Cameron and Dr. Jim Burns.

Jean: Hi. I am a long-time listener and a supporter and my husband recently attended Every Man's Battle and I just want to give an endorsement, a hearty endorsement, to that program. Going into something like this, a lot of guilt, a lot of shame, a lot of isolation.

What he shared with me in terms of how your facilitators talked to the men, how there was a sense of honesty I don't know that he's ever experienced like he did, the connection with the other attendees both in the large group but particularly in the small group, he returned a hopeful, hopeful man and my heart is full and I just want to thank you all so much.

Brian Perez: Wow. So was it the Every Man's Battle that just took place this weekend or a previous one?

Jean: A previous one.

Brian Perez: Okay, so you've had a few months to see a difference?

Jean: A little bit, yes.

Brian Perez: How long have you guys been married?

Jean: Quite a long time. Nearly 40 years.

Brian Perez: What made him come to the realization that this is something he needed to attend?

Jean: The last time he was viewing something on television which was not pornography, but I happened to be in an area where I could see what was happening in the struggle and there have been a number of times that we've talked and I brought things to his attention. But this time, I told him that what I saw just strikes me so much as an addiction, as an addict, and I said you have got to do something.

He knew about your program years ago, had looked into it, but between the timing, the location, and the cost, and the sense that I can do this, I can soldier on, those things prevented it. But it was just amazing and I'm so grateful. So thank you and if anybody I know, a man is not going to listen to a woman necessarily about this, but I highly, highly encourage consideration of this to bring something into the light, into a situation where people are encouraging and not wiping over, not glossing over, but giving you the tools and pointing you to the Lord in a way that is so specific to this particular battle.

Jim Burns: Jean, I wanted to ask you on a personal level, what did you have to do as he was preparing for him to go to that conference? Now, what are some of the action steps that some of our listeners who have husbands who are in the same place, but maybe they haven't gone yet, what advice would you give to them?

Jean: I would first of all suggest that the wives seek support for themselves, which I did quite some time ago. and I would encourage gentleness in the way you encourage your husband. I think to be as understanding and compassionate, but in my case, I had mentioned this before years ago, but this time, what I witnessed and brought to his attention and he couldn't deny and he just realized, "Yeah, I can't do this on my own."

Mark Cameron: Well, I'm proud of you, Jean. I'm proud of you for confronting your husband. Confrontations are not a bad thing. Sometimes we assume that means conflict is about to happen, but conflict doesn't always occur from a confrontation and as you're explaining here, that confrontation was needed in order to be able to bring him to that realization.

I think it is powerful for you to tell that story and so I think that's an encouragement for wives out there to don't delay, don't let it go years, confront in a healthy way. The Bible says it's the kindness of the Lord that leads us to repentance. So you're right, when we go in attacking and guns blazing, that creates shame and defensiveness comes out, but it's something that needs to be addressed.

Brian Perez: That is what Jean said, she approached her husband in a gentle way. She could have gone guns blazing, just like, "I can't believe you're doing that," but she was just like, "Honey, we need to talk. You need to go to Every Man's Battle."

We'll talk a little more about Every Man's Battle when we come back. Jean, thank you so much for calling in with your endorsement and your recommendation of Every Man's Battle. We'll be right back on New Life LIVE.

Every day, we hear from people all over the world who are looking for hope. They've been lost in a relationship struggle, addiction, anxiety, depression, all kinds of ways. Wouldn't you love to be part of a rescue team? Don't miss your opportunity to be part of something that changes lives every single day because everyone matters. Your generosity helps find them. And we've seen God work in the lives of so many people over the years here at New Life, and we want to invite you to be part of what God is doing. 99 for the 1 is our partner program that you can give to the ministry on a monthly basis to make sure that we continue to reach out to the lost. Call 1-800-NEW-LIFE, 1-800-639-5433, or newlife.com/99for1. Join the mission: Rescue the one and restore the many.

To find out more information about New Life or to order any of the resources mentioned on today's program, call 1-800-NEW-LIFE. Now back to New Life LIVE.

We were just speaking with Jean who gave us a hearty endorsement for Every Man's Battle and the next one is happening August 7th in Dallas. You can register online at newlife.com or you can call us at 1-800-NEW-LIFE.

Something Jean also mentioned was that different things got in the way. Sometimes it was the location, sometimes it was when it was happening or finances. Well, we offer need-based scholarships for our intensives, not just Every Man's Battle, but also Restore and Intimacy in Marriage. So you can find out more about that when you call us at 1-800-NEW-LIFE.

We also offer the Every Man's Battle podcast and if you have not been listening to the Every Man's Battle podcast, you are missing out. It is so good. Fortunately, we have the episodes on our YouTube channel, so check it out. We also offer bonus content from the podcast sent monthly by email and anyone can sign up to receive it. Just send an email to embpod@newlife.com with the words "bonus content" in the subject line. Again, that address is E-M-B-P-O-D at newlife dot com.

Shall we go back to the phones, guys? Speaking of Dallas, Texas, Renee, thank you so much for calling in today to New Life LIVE. You're on with Mark and Jim.

Renee: Thank you so much for taking my call. I'm a monthly supporter and I just want to tell everybody out there, if you're listening, you're being blessed, so bless the ministry.

Brian Perez: Thank you, Renee. God bless you.

Renee: I had a question. My stepmom and my parents were married 35 years. My dad passed away five years ago and my stepmom has been living by herself. Well, my nephew, who was 22 at the time, got into bad drugs and so she let him move in. He wouldn't keep a job, wouldn't clean up.

Two years ago, her daughter suddenly passed away and she found her and it was devastating. Her health started going downhill and she was going to move into a nursing home and I said no, let me move in, I'll help take care of you. We're not going to let you go to a nursing home.

Anyway, he was there, he tried to move his girlfriend in and they were doing drugs and I said no, and so they moved out, eloped. But now she got pregnant, so last December, she let him move back in for a couple months to get their life together. Well, her family took her in but wouldn't take him.

She filed for divorce. Anyway, he won't get a job, he's doing the same thing. I think he's on bipolar meds but he started marijuana, smoking in the house. We told him he couldn't. Now my stepmom is here and him on the phone saying that he's very angry with me and he might hurt me. So she's afraid for my safety.

Last week he was going to hurt himself, so he called 911, thank goodness, because I don't know what would have happened if my stepmom had found him. Anyway, he's in the hospital. I had the pastor come talk to her yesterday, but she's still going to let him back in and my sister, she doesn't want to deal with it because her husband died last year and now she's kind of living the life that she's always wanted. So she just dumped him on us. He's 25, about to be 26. I'm afraid for my safety. We got locks on our doors at night and we lock our doors, and I just can't deal with it.

I feel guilty leaving her by herself, but she's choosing to let him back in. I mean, she doesn't want him there. She told me to take care of it one time and when I tried, she yelled at me. She's like, "You're not going to tell me what to do," and I'm like, "I'm not, I'm just asking you, we need to give him a timeline to get a job, get his stuff, get his life together," and she never follows through. She's just like, "I'm just praying about it." I'm like, "Prayer is good, but you need an action plan."

She won't do that. Before it was just not a good situation, now she even said, "I'm hearing him talk to people on the phone and I'm afraid for your safety. He might hurt you."

Mark Cameron: Wow, Renee, so your stepmom is a classic codependent. These types of situations happen where they just get so complicated, so entangled, it almost feels like it's impossible to start to untangle it. But you are very aware, you're seeing it and unfortunately because you live there, you're embroiled in it too.

I understand the guilt feeling, but I think your nervous system, your body is telling you something: There's a danger here. The fact that he's making these statements and your stepmom herself is saying that you may need to be concerned... I think you may have to set down that marker of, "If he moves back in, we are going to have to move out."

This is a great time to have him not move back in because he's hospitalized right now and when you're hospitalized, it sounds like it's an involuntary type thing. He's likely under the care of a psychiatrist and they're putting him on medications. Somebody who has bipolar disorder, they really need medications because it's a medical imbalance. You can't think your way out of it and you have these highs and you have these lows. It's not really your fault, but it impacts you and it impacts others. People with bipolar disorder, they can tend to make very extreme decisions when they are in a manic mood here.

But I think your body's trying to tell you something and I think you're right. I think you may have to put that marker down and say, "If he moves back in, we're going to have to move out." That doesn't mean that you can't check on her, but every state has something called Adult Protective Services. So if he does move back in and then some concerning things happen, you don't have to deal with this alone. You can make a call to Adult Protective Services and you can say, "Hey, I'm feeling some concern."

Then the county starts to step in. Sometimes it takes the crisis to happen. It actually often takes the crisis to occur for people to work their way out of a pattern like this and that's what the codependency pattern is. People just stay stuck, they stay embroiled. But I think you're seeing. It's like watching a train about to wreck. You can see that's about to happen and the best thing that you can do if you're not in control of the train is to get off the tracks.

Jim Burns: Renee, first let me also say thank you so much for your support to New Life. You said that at the very beginning and so grateful for that. Then you call and you are in a mess.

Actually, the perfect place for him to be is that hospital and I'll tell you why. The reason is because before they leave, typically there's a plan to be made. I'm not sure you're going to be able to be involved in it much because you're a tad bit distant, but your stepmom can be. So your stepmom needs a plan. You said that. She's not listening to your plan, so really the plan of a professional is kind of a simple plan, and that simple plan is he may need to go on for other care someplace else. He may need to live someplace else.

If your stepmom is involved in that or you, and if you can get into it, great. He has to give permission at his age for that to happen. But if you can work through a plan that keeps him from being in the home, that's probably better for him. Long term, you want him to thrive. He's not going to thrive back if he goes into a home with a codependent because the codependent's going to allow the same thing to happen over and over again.

So if that plan that the hospital helps make with you... it might be that psychiatrist, sometimes they'll have a counselor in there... I would jump into that and see if they can't tell them exactly what you told us. They're going to help kind of create that plan.

Your stepmom has to also part of the plan is for him, part of the plan is for her. When Mark said, or you say, "I'm going to have to move out," that isn't a bad thing. That can sometimes be a good thing because what happens is you're kind of still creating a crisis and she's going to have to decide, "Do I want Renee who's loving and caring and unbelievably loving and caring because this is just my stepdaughter, or do I want him in this room with me?"

It may be that that is all she needs is to say it's either create a plan and he doesn't come back or I'm going to have to move. You're not saying you're walking away from her or you're walking away from the relationship. What you are saying is, we need some tough love here and that's where with a codependent, sometimes it doesn't come from the family, sometimes it comes from the professionals that that young man is already dealing with.

Brian Perez: Renee, thanks for your phone call today here on New Life LIVE. We do have to take a break now. Thank you so much for calling in and thank you for being one of our supporters. We have the 99 for the 1 partners. These are the people who support us on a monthly basis. You can find out more about that at newlife.com or by calling us at 1-800-NEW-LIFE. We'll be right back with more of your calls here on New Life LIVE.

To find out more information about New Life or to order any of the resources mentioned on today's program, call 1-800-NEW-LIFE. Now back to New Life LIVE.

We are going to be in the studio for another hour after this hour is complete, so keep on calling. 1-800-229-3000. Remember, you don't have to use your real name, you can call on behalf of a friend if they don't want to call in. We can talk about so many issues here on New Life LIVE, just like we've done for the last 37 years. 1-800-229-3000 is the number. If it matters to you, it matters to us.

We've got something going on this Thursday, by the way. Our friend Dr. Alice Benton is hosting a webinar. You can watch it online. You don't have to go anywhere. It's going to be there in your own living room or den or bedroom, wherever you choose to watch. It's called "Grief: Hope and Healing After Loss." It's for everyone because loss is a universal experience.

You can learn more about this webinar by calling 1-800-NEW-LIFE or going to newlife.com. You can also text the word "webinar" to 28950. We will text you back a registration link and you'll also get a free tip sheet on grief when you text "webinar" to 28950. It's $24.99 for 90 minutes. It includes 30 minutes of Q&A.

If you can't join us this Thursday, sign up for the webinar anyway because after it's done, you'll get a link where you can watch the webinar for up to seven days. You won't be able to take part in the Q&A because you'll get the recorded webinar, but you'll still benefit immensely. So sign up for it. It's happening this Thursday.

1-800-229-3000 is our number and let's go to Virginia Beach. Here is Laura, who listens to us on Sirius XM Channel 131. Hey, Laura, welcome to New Life LIVE.

Laura: Thank you, thank you so much. I wanted to chime in and say I also have listened to you guys from early, early decades ago. Absolutely love all that you provide. You're such a blessing. I do give periodically as well.

I just wanted to call in just to also let folks know, the previous caller by the way, who mentioned that she had a family member in the house and he's bipolar... I just wanted to put out there, I have a sibling, I'm the oldest of six, and I have a sibling decades he started with bipolar and he's on the high end. As you mentioned, they're manic, they can have highs and lows. He has been aggressive, he has been violent.

I just wanted to offer for her that yes, he does not need to be definitely in the home with them because of his action. He can even get income, he could be, if he's diagnosed, they have a process, he can get food stamps and a little income and they can provide housing and counseling. They will provide doctors and follow-up and it's a beautiful thing. So I just wanted to as an eyewitness just offer that and put that out there for all of the callers as well. There are a lot of services out there.

Brian Perez: Well, we appreciate that, Laura. and these services are readily available. Why do you think people don't take advantage of them more often? Could it just be because they don't know about them or what do you think?

Laura: I think they don't know about it. As a matter of fact, my mom just passed and as the oldest, I retired last year just to help with care for her with my sister. and a lot of people don't know that I hired a medical staff, a medical company that became her at-home doctor and they walked us through her condition. Every week a nurse came in, an aide came in, they provided supplies, all through her Medicare. So people need to check their Medicaid, their Medicare benefits and you would be surprised what is out there.

Jim Burns: Laura, you are explaining that so well. Sometimes people don't do it because they don't know, simply don't know, and so that's where they have to... you did some work. You did some looking around, you did some digging and you found good things. Sometimes they don't trust, and maybe somebody's had a bad experience with the government.

But that's not normal. I normally hear good things. Now again, where they're getting their housing and where they're getting their counseling, sometimes there's probably better places to live or sometimes even get counseling. But the point that I'm saying is that it's actually readily available and again, like I appreciate that even with our previous caller, if she didn't know that, then she could call Department of Social Services. She could go online and just look it up and at least get the insight and input on steer me in the right direction. But they've got to do the work. They've got to roll up their sleeves a little bit because it is a research. That's true. You do have to put the work in and kind of look.

Laura: It could be different names, could be Department of Behavioral Services, NAMI, the National Association of Mental Illness. Every area has their local offices. Yeah, there's so much out there, people. You don't have to suffer and have this person in your home. Laura, did you say this was your brother?

This was my brother.

Mark Cameron: Is he on medication now?

Laura: Absolutely.

Mark Cameron: and how's that stabilized things for him?

Laura: It's been an up and down because they give him meds and then they have to try them and sometimes it doesn't work, they have to switch it up. Sometimes he doesn't take it. He feels, "Oh, I'm healed, I don't need it," and he doesn't take it. because he does smoke and it's a lot with it. So it's not a one and done where they person goes, they get diagnosed, they give him meds and then, "Okay, we're set." No, they have to track the meds, see how it's affecting the person, look at their lifestyle, make sure they're not doing drugs and marijuana, drinking, that influences it.

Mark Cameron: and that's common where people have bipolar disorder when they're in that upper, what we call feeling really good, they won't take their medications because they feel good. Sounds like you guys had to hold some very strong boundaries at times and do some of the things that Jim and I were suggesting to Renee.

Laura: Absolutely. and it also involved in blocking the person on the phone because they will drive you crazy. They will go on and on and thank God for services and you guys, but a lot of folks don't know. They just don't know and I want to just put that out there.

Mark Cameron: No, this is a good encouragement that it takes a team approach, it takes a family, it takes everybody getting together. and again, it's not about blaming the person who has the diagnosis because they don't choose to have this diagnosis and it severely impacts them. But we need to recognize reality that it does have a significant impact on them and others around. Sometimes we've got to hold those really strong, uncomfortable boundaries at times so the crisis does happen so the person moves towards recovery.

Jim Burns: I just want to praise you, Laura, for letting us know and for letting our listeners know about because again, you did the work and that can motivate anybody who has a struggle in this area to go do the research, do the work. A lot of times it's going to come out a lot better. It's not perfect, it's complicated, but you keep doing it.

Brian Perez: Thank you so much for calling in today to New Life LIVE. We're going to be in the studio for another hour, so please keep calling in. 1-800-229-3000. Remember, you don't have to use your real name. Mark, Jim, and I do have to use our real names, but you don't have to when you call in to 1-800-229-3000. We'll talk to you next time.

Thank you so much for listening. We hope something you heard will help you live in freedom today. If this content was helpful for you, we would love it if you would take a minute, leave a review, post about it, and rate it. Remember, we have resources and workshops online for you as you continue your journey. Go to newlife.com to find out more information. and thank you for being part of the New Life community. We know that God desires all of us to live a life of wholeness and healing and we're so glad that you're here.