New Life LIVE

New Life: Welcome to the New Life LIVE podcast. We hope to provide help and hope in your life through God's word, counselors, and psychologists as we answer questions from listeners who call with the challenges of life. Let's go to today's episode.

Hello, welcome to New Life LIVE. I'm Brian, I'll be your host for the next two hours that we're in the studio. If you're tired of toxic relationships, guess what, so are we. We want to help you take the first step towards safe and healthy relationships. Call us right now at 1-800-229-3000. Here to help you today, we've got doctor of marriage and family therapist Sherry Denham Kepper. Hi Sherry.

Sherry: Well, hey, great to be with you both today.

New Life: And clinical psychologist Dr. Alice Benton. Hello Alice, what's on your mind to get us going?

Alice: How do you get breakthrough from unhealthy, even dangerous habits, attitudes, or behaviors? I worked with a client once who had explosive anger, so explosive that everyone was frightened of this person. This client used alcohol and self-harm to try to manage the anger, really to try to protect the people in the family and in the community.

Self-harm was a way to turn the anger and violence inward rather than outward. So actually, there was good motivation, there was good desire and purpose in the behaviors. This client could not get change despite a whole lot of time on the knees in prayer.

What's your unhealthy habit that you can't overcome? Or what's your family member's unhealthy habit that they can't overcome? Is it also substance use? Is it vaping? I'm hearing from so many adolescents who are turning to vaping as a way to calm themselves and energize themselves. Is it screen addiction, sexual integrity, overeating?

God's solution and his great antidote is confession. James 5:16, confess your sins to one another so that you can pray for one another and be healed. Confession, not just to God but also to other people, is where we really see the change process launch off.

With that client I was discussing, I was so honored to be a part of that person making confessions to almost all the people in the inner circle that had been hurt by that explosive anger, that had been terrified by the self-harm and the alcohol use. As those confessions continued, change grew within the client but also within the family and the community.

Because change starting with confession then tails into greater awareness both of how my behavior affects the people around me. If I can know, oh, you're afraid of me? I didn't know that. Well, I can actually have some compassion and empathy for you. Compassion and empathy keep motivating a person to change. Receiving mercy and forgiveness is one of the ways that a soul who's been injured and angry and afraid is just bathed in comfort. When we get that right kind of comfort, again, we want to change.

All this really has to be paired with grace. One confession alone is not enough. But if confession is followed by a structured change process like our therapy that we provide at New Life, like our intensives, if it's combined with accountability and loving community, then a person can change entirely and become the man or woman God created them to be. Sherry, any thoughts?

Sherry: I was just thinking about the power of confession. As I was listening to you Alice, it's a form of ownership. It's somebody taking that step to say, "I am owning the harm that I've done to you and to me."

There's something about when we take something out of the dark, even though this person, they weren't in the dark doing it, they were doing it out loud. But that step of confession where they hear themselves and they go, "Wow, I'm really hurting me and I'm hurting you and I don't want to do this anymore." That's the first step of change.

New Life: There's blessing in confessing and we can talk about that for the next two hours here on New Life LIVE. 1-800-229-3000.

We would love to pray for you here at New Life. We've got a way to send us your prayer requests on the New Life website. Just click "Contact Us" in the footer at newlife.com. 1-800-229-3000 is our number. Alice?

Alice: Many of our callers tell us we are the first people they were able to confess to, that we might be their safe people. So if you have something hanging over you and you want to call in today and start your change process, confess with us first.

New Life: We've got two hours to do it, so call in. Let's start our time on the phones with Teresa in Texas who's watching us on YouTube. Thank you for calling 1-800-229-3000.

Teresa: Hello. I'm calling for a friend, she's going to listen in now or maybe later. I listen all the time, so here, I jotted down everything I needed to say. She got a call from her attorney, she recently filed for divorce after 14 years. She's having all these mixed emotions that kind of surfaced now that the papers are going to be served.

Here's what I jotted down she wanted you to know. She's been married 14 years, it'll be 14 years actually in July. Her husband has been in a relationship with another woman for several years. Financially, he's not contributed to the household, minimally has he done anything. Recently the boat and storage has been repossessed. He talks about her sometimes physically about her appearance.

They met after she left college, so her whole adulthood, they dated seven years, been married almost 14, so that's all she knows. He won't go to counseling. He's currently asking for money. He's a contractor, so work is slow and he's asking for money. They've not been intimate in over a year and a half.

Now they only communicate via text. She moved out, she's staying with a friend of hers. They communicate via text over the past month. She hasn't talked to him on the phone, it's been like a month and a half. She hasn't seen him at all but they mostly communicate via text.

Now this is what I had for them and then for her, some info on her. These are the quotes that she said, she's annoyed with herself for tolerating certain behavior for so long. He's not the man she married. She says she's feeling guilty, overwhelmed, and sad, and been stressed for several years.

She's kind of looking forward to the weight of being lifted off her shoulder through the divorce. Some of the things I thought she said that was kind of important that she's never made a major decision. This is like one of the last things she said to me before we got off the line. She's never made a major decision for herself, someone else always made the decision.

She was a competitive athlete growing up since like age six and even into college. So be it her parents or college coaches made major decisions for her life and then soon after, about two months after leaving college, she moved back home and she met her husband. She said this is the first time that she's made a decision for herself and it makes me want to cry because I love her so dearly and I'm proud of her.

She says that she's just always been done what she was told and that she's feeling the emotion. The question I know you guys always ask the question, we've kind of narrowed it down to a couple of questions. One of the questions, of course, is it normal to feel the doubt and second guess herself about the end in marriage? Is she doing the right thing? Because he is not willing to go to counseling, he doesn't want to do anything. He's saying all the right things via text, that I love you and all these things. Her question was how to remain firm when communicating and strong and firm when communicating with him because they'll have to make decisions about the house because she moved out and he's still in the house.

Sherry: Teresa, you did a good job, by the way, for this precious friend of yours. First off, she's doing the right thing. I know you said he is a contractor, but I think he has been a con-man for some time with her. Why do I say that? Because he's been deceptive for so long. He's been sexually deceptive, he's had a long-term affair.

It makes sense to me why your friend has been so stressed and distressed for the last several years because she's been living with somebody who has a double life. Financially, this boat and all that storage is going to be repossessed, he's been financially irresponsible with her and for himself. What does that mean? That means he doesn't have integrity. He doesn't have financial integrity, he doesn't have relational integrity.

This is the cookie, this is what I think is hooking your friend. In a text message when he says, "I love you," that is just so easy for a contractor con-man to say because he's trying to keep her hooked so that he can get further into his lifestyle where he's already been having an affair. This is a long-term affair. So he's just basically holding on to your friend in order to establish more of his life separate from her.

But he's got it good. He's got the house, he's got the girl, he doesn't have to pay his bills, and he's got her hooked. So I want her to hear me and I hope you can encourage her, she needs to unhook because she has been the engine and he's been on the caboose dragging this train into more demise for a long time.

Unhooking from somebody who's been using her is a big step. There's a lot of fear because, like you said, she's never made a big decision on her own. You know what I wondered when you were talking about how people made decisions for her? There's another part of being a player for all those years since she was six years old on competitive sports. I'm just imagining all these coaches that have been speaking into her life, parents telling her what she needs to do to perform better and whatever sport she was in. Come on, do this or that.

But you know what also we're afraid of when we've got all these voices telling us what we need to do to get better, to perfect that, hone that skill? We're afraid of making a mistake. It's not that other people have made decisions for her only, but I think it does something because we're afraid of making a mistake.

So you second-guess yourself because you don't want to fail. You don't want to do it imperfectly. You want to stay in the game, like you're committed. Athletes are tough people. They have to have this incredible tenacity and resilience when you're up against hard. You have to do things but I just think there's a vulnerability in not being able to just let go and let the game fail. Just count it a loss, my dear. Count it a loss and count it an opportunity for you to get free for the first time in a long time. You're making the right decision and I'm proud of you just like your friend Teresa is proud of you. I'm proud of you. It's a big decision but I think you're on the right road.

Alice: Teresa, I think your friend's emotions are completely normal, especially given what she's gone through and how she grew up. Some concerns I have are certainly that he's asking her for money. I'm just going to see if I can get some money. It's like he's a panhandler.

I hope your friend sets up an accountability system with you and other safe women in her life that if he asks for anything, probably the answer should always be no. But she should also vet any of that with you all first before she agrees to anything with him. I think she has an atrophied decision-making muscle and it's going to take working that muscle out, practicing making decisions with safe sisters around her who are helping guide her but letting her make the decisions. That will strengthen her ability to stand strong against him.

I do think it's right to move towards a divorce and it's biblical because this is one of those situations where if a husband is abandoning a wife and he's having an affair, those are the two situations where God says yes, divorce is permissible and the better option than remaining with this evil being perpetrated against her. The Bible does tell us to address that perpetrator with a witness and it sounds like she's done all of the steps already. I would just have her prayerfully consider has she done that, has she had somebody else also point out to him what he's doing and what's wrong with it other than that? I would say getting those sisters around her and strengthening her decision-making muscle.

New Life: What do you think, Teresa, is this going to help?

Teresa: Yes, thank you so much.

New Life: Thanks for calling into New Life today.

Sherry: Teresa, you might think about as a dear friend of hers, getting her a copy of my book, Intimate Deception: Healing the Wounds of Sexual Betrayal. You can order that through us, you can get it on Amazon, however you want to do it, but you could do that and send it to her. There are so many chapters in there that I think will empower her. One of the chapters is called "No is a Complete Sentence" and it's all about boundaries. When you've been betrayed and you're being used and, like Dr. Alice said, asked for money, she needs to know how to lay down a hard line. Gift her with that book and I think it will be a good resource for her.

New Life: It's called Intimate Deception by Dr. Sherry Denham Kepper and it's available for purchase in the newlife.com store. 1-800-229-3000 is the number to call us today.

Now we're going to talk to Elarine in Birmingham, Alabama, who listens to us on the New Life podcast. Yes, we're available as a podcast in case you can't watch us or listen to us on the radio, you can catch the podcast afterwards. Hi there, Elarine.

Elarine: Hi, good afternoon. Thank you all for taking my call. I just wanted to ask this question because I've been listening to see if anyone else will ask it so I could get the answer without having to call.

New Life: No, Elarine, it's you who's got to call. I guess what we would have never had a chance to meet you if you didn't call. So this is our blessing today. Everyone else listening and watching who's like wondering, hoping that someday somebody will call in with their question. Not going to happen. You better call right now, 1-800-229-3000. Go ahead, Elarine.

Elarine: Okay. So I was a child that came from abandonment. Just a slight little bit background to show you why I'm enjoying where I am right now. Abusers, just one narcissist after the other. I've gotten to this place now where my children are grown and gone and I'm so alone. In the beginning it felt weird, like I felt lost. Like I've been a mother, I've been a wife. But now it happened that I am so loving the alone life. I am pampering myself, just enjoying my own company, listening to my podcast and just spending time with the Lord. It's so serene that I am feared to lose that. So my question is, is this a normal place to be? Or is it just for a time? Or is it just a season?

New Life: That is a great question. Elarine, give us a few minutes to discuss and then we'll come back to you with the answer. We would love to speak with you today, call in at 1-800-229-3000. Alice?

Alice: Elarine, it sure makes sense that you finally have peace and serenity in your home after years of dealing with very difficult and maybe even abusive people. To be happy being alone, I get it. As you're asking though if this should just be for a season, I am curious, are people around you, people who love you, expressing concern that you're too isolated?

Elarine: Yes, they think I have too much to offer to not want a relationship again.

Alice: And who are the people that express that to you?

Elarine: Other females and a friend of mine, she had similar experience with the narcissist, the first narcissist bed.

Alice: And with all the ways people have hurt you, what kind of recovery work or structured professional help have you received to heal some of those wounds?

Elarine: I did counseling for about five years with a very, very good counselor. I've been reading books from you guys and I've been listening for years on your radio, on the radio.

Alice: And you said you had been married. Have you been married more than once? And were the men who were romantic partners, were they all also narcissists and abusive or mistreated you?

Elarine: Yes, as I look back, the very first husband I got married at age 19 and he was seven months older than me. I look back at that marriage and I realize he was a narcissist, that's why he cheated and when I took my concerns to him, he would beat me up. Then after he died and I got away from him, I married another one and it was like they were all the same person, just different faces.

I realized after reading and studying and just being informed now that my dad was a narcissist because he was a molester. I learned from you guys that not all narcissists are pedophiles, but all pedophiles are narcissists. So my dad definitely was one and my mom was numb and she abandoned us.

So now for the first time in my life, I have peace. I can love me. I can be by myself and actually enjoy being by myself. I don't need sex, I don't need anyone saying, "I love you, you're beautiful," because I am an attractive woman and I look really young for my age. I don't need validation, I don't need anything. It is such an awesome place to be. I get my validation from the scriptures that I don't want this to only be a season.

Sherry: I love what you're saying and you know who you make me think about is you make me wonder about the woman at the well, Elarine, who there was a lot of men that narcissistically used her. She found herself for the first time in the presence of the first man she ever met which was Jesus, who was very safe and he knew all about her. She knew that in their dialogue.

God gave that woman more landscape in the Bible than any other story because I think there's so much power in it. But he saw her, he loved her, and the very reflection of the fact that he knew her and loved her just for who she was, she'd never had that before. He was helping her see herself.

I honestly think you're somewhat like her. For the first time in your life, you're seeing yourself and you're realizing how lovable and worthy you are of time, attention, and safety. I love the ancient Hebrew word for peace. If you go back in ancient Hebrew and look at the word pictures, the word peace means to destroy the authority that establishes chaos. I feel like, Elarine, you are in life right now, not a season, but you're in life and you've made a big turn and you are destroying the authority that established chaos and you're saying, "I am for the first time loving myself."

Now what's really funny is do you know how uncomfortable people are when people aren't together with somebody? You might just have some friends, even dear friends, that might narcissistically wish that you'd be with someone. And now you've got this dissonance. Oh no, oh no, oh no, they're telling me I really should be with someone, I have all these traits and I'm like no. You get to be you and you get to sit with who you are and enjoy where you're at. You don't have to do what somebody else says just because they're uncomfortable with you being uncoupled.

Elarine: Oh, I was just in tears because it is so true. He saw me, he saw my brokenness, he saw everything and he still loved me. When I met with the Lord and he loved me and he says I am precious and he knows every hair on my head, the number of them. I was a thought in his mind even before I was a thought in my parents' mind, he fashioned me and he made me. And I'm learning that for the first time in my life. I can love and I'm believing it now. It's not like it's new to the hearing, but I can receive it and believe it now.

Sherry: You're feeling it, you're feeling it. And having been abandoned as a little kid, did your dad molest you or someone else?

Elarine: All of us he did.

Sherry: Oh, sweetheart. Yes, so you think about how unsafe you were in with your dad to have him molest you and your siblings and he was the first man in your life and wasn't unsafe. So that impacts a human being, impacts you as a female. I know there's a lot of women right now listening to you as you're sharing with us, Elarine. And this is why I'm glad you called is because you've just given a whole bunch of people, whether they're men or women who've been molested, hope that they can someday, like you, find peace in their own presence and find peace with God. A lot of people run, they run, they're trying to run away from the past and the hurt and you're settling into this really sweet season of loving yourself and being loved by God. I just know you're a hope-giver for that, so thank you.

Alice: Your body and soul need rest, so this is a time of rest and we can't know how long it will last. But there is a problem in isolation. You are a life-giver, we're feeling it. Sherry and I were commenting on it when we were in the break. Just your voice, your intonation, you give life and grace to the people around you and I think your well-meaning friends see that.

Elarine: That's what people tell me every day. All I do is touch them and fix their hair, make them look beautiful and they just say this is just healing for them. So I feel like I don't need a lover to give back.

Alice: That's exactly right and we are built for community. So your friends and God hope you'll share that gift you have, the love you have with other people, but it doesn't have to be in another marriage. So don't feel hurried into that. But I would have you ask God where and with whom do you want me to share my talents, my love, and my peace? Because other people need that too from you. I hope you'll share. You did with us and a lot of people listening today.

New Life: What do you think, Elarine, is this going to help?

Elarine: Yes, thank you so much for the answer.

New Life: What about the Bible verse that says it is not good for man to be alone? Of course Elarine's a woman, but the same principle could apply. People might be thinking, "Well, wait a minute, isn't there that one special someone for everybody? We should be encouraging Elarine to not want to just be in this season of singleness, but she should be out there and looking for someone else."

Sherry: And what do you say to the Apostle Paul? What do you say to Jesus who walked the earth? I mean, I really want you to think about that because I think a lot of us have anxiety when there's an amazing human being that is a lover that is okay being uncoupled. Why does that create anxiety in us? I think it forces us to really look at ourselves. Because Apostle Paul had a ministry and fact, a number of the disciples had a ministry. Mary Magdalene, I mean, think about those that ran with Jesus. I think Peter, wasn't he the only one that was actually coupled that we know of directly?

So yeah, I think we need to just give people space to find their own way and it doesn't mean you have to be in a relationship to have a wonderful, loving, full life of caring for others.

New Life: But then there's people who just feel they haven't come to that place like Elarine. So let's talk to them right now and just show them that they don't have to just run from one person to the other. I knew someone years ago who was like that, always seemed to have a new boyfriend every month kind of thing. Then two or three marriages that ended in divorce. It has been years, probably a decade since she's even dated anybody. And now, guess what, she's found someone and it looks like they're getting married later this year. But she took that time to just kind of walk away and just, you know what, I'm just going to focus on other things right now. It's okay to do it.

Alice: If we struggle to be content alone and we think a relationship will solve that, I think that's misdirection. It may feel like it solves it temporarily, but in the long term, it doesn't tend to. So to be able to be content alone with friends, with other people around but outside of romantic relationship makes it more likely that eventual romantic relationship will be successful.

New Life: Very good. Elarine, thanks for calling us today here on New Life LIVE. 1-800-229-3000 is the number to call us today and now we're going to talk to Renee and Gil will talk to you in a little bit.

When individuals and families reach out to New Life searching for answers, healing, and the reassurance that they are not alone, it's your financial partnership that allows us to meet them where they are and provide real solutions. We are so thankful whether you give online at newlife.com or by calling 1-800-NEW-LIFE or by texting NLM to 228950. Remember your generosity changes lives.

Another thing we want to talk about is the Intimacy in Marriage intensive that is happening in just a few weeks in Orange County, California, Valentine's Day weekend of all dates, February 13th through the 15th. Come on out for this, just this time for your marriage to be edified, encouraged. Some people, your marriage does not have to be on the brink of divorce to benefit from the Intimacy in Marriage intensive. You could be having the best time of your life. You might also be engaged, about to pop the question or you've already popped the question, you're going to be getting married later this year. Maybe that friend that I was talking about can attend this with her fiance.

But again, it's just what couples need to kind of get unstuck from maybe having a roommate relationship where you've been married for decades and now it seems things are just you hardly see each other, you're like two ships passing in the night and you're okay with that, like the call that we had earlier where they're already separated but it's just text messages back and forth. It's not supposed to be that way, right?

Alice: And you're right, Brian, that our intensive helps marriages that are teetering into divorce and it can help the best marriage get an upgrade. So it's for the entire spectrum of how well or how poorly you feel like you're doing in your marriage.

New Life: So come on out, it's Valentine's Day weekend in Orange County, California. We've got an early bird discount set up if you sign up by this Friday, January 30th. We can get you that discount, so do it right now while it's fresh on your mind. Don't put it off, you'll forget later. Just call 1-800-NEW-LIFE or go to our website, newlife.com. We would love to help you with just cutting through these surface-level fixes and getting to the heart of what is dividing you guys.

In just three days while working with licensed Christian counselors, you'll gain new understanding, learn practical biblical tools, and begin to experience renewed spiritual, emotional, and physical intimacy. You can get all the details and register at newlife.com. And again, it's about all kinds of intimacy. You hear the word intimacy in marriage, you might be thinking about physical intimacy. No, there's so much more to a marriage than that. Let us help you. Call 1-800-NEW-LIFE or go to newlife.com to get all the details about intimacy in marriage and then sign up.

If you know someone who's getting married, encourage them to attend this, maybe you can gift it to them. You can say, "Hey, I'm going to pay." You weren't sure what to get them as a wedding present, well, send them to Intimacy in Marriage, that might help immensely. Again, go to newlife.com or call 1-800-NEW-LIFE. And if you want to talk to Drs. Alice Benton and Sherry Denham Kepper, there's still time, plenty of time. We're going to be in the studio for another hour after this one's complete so call in to 1-800-229-3000.

So we know that you may not be able to call in when we're here in the studio, so we've set up a couple of other ways for you to get your question to us. You can leave us a voicemail or you can send us an email and all the instructions on how to do that are on our website. We've dedicated a page to it, it's newlife.com/radio. So go there to find us out how to send us an email or a voicemail if you can't call in like you can right now to 1-800-229-3000.

Here's a question that was sent in to us from Pat in Connecticut. The question is what can we do for our six-year-old grandson who has lost family members? I have a six-year-old grandson that has been showing more and more signs of unresolved trauma, says Pat. A little backstory: his grandmother on his father's side died of cancer two and a half years ago. Then a year later, his grandfather on his mother's side, whom he was very close to, was killed tragically.

His mom talks to him about it regularly and he seemed to be doing okay and taking it all fairly well. But as of late, he talks about death many times a day. He's also mentioned that he wants to die so that he can see Grandpa again. He's been acting out, lying, and stealing little things such as candy that he can't have. He's been seeing a counselor that the school provides, but it doesn't seem to be enough. Pat asks what would you suggest? It's heartbreaking to see this sweet little boy like this and we feel like it'll only get worse if it isn't addressed. That is so tough. What do you say to Pat?

Alice: I applaud the mother who's talking about these things openly because our mistake is to think if I bring this up and he's doing well, I might make it worse. But rather making it a very permissible topic, saying that feeling sad, feeling angry, feeling scared, any of these things are okay and they're normal. Normalizing the feelings and the talk makes it safe for the six-year-old to discuss it.

So having an agreement between the grandparents and the mother making sure that's okay with the mom, that would be I think the best grandparent approach. Having some child books that talk about death, that talk about heaven, even watching age-appropriate movies that can just help elicit thoughts on the topic is good. If the school counselor's work seems insufficient, then I would search out a specialist within our network for grief recovery, especially to include family therapy and some extended family therapy if you grandparents are in the child's life on a regular basis. Then you can get on the same strategies about how to both handle his struggling emotions but also his negative behavior. He's acting out, which is normal, but we want to meet that acting out with a lot of love and understanding and consistent discipline.

Sherry: I hear a lot of trauma. Like a little guy who's trying to hold on to something so no one can take it away from him. Like even with the candy that he's stealing, I always say the phrase that I believe that all behavior is purposeful. So if I will just kind of get into helicopter view and begin to look at what the behavior is that he's actually doing, it has a purpose to it.

So he's lost both grandfathers, tragic, quick losses, didn't have a chance. And at six years old in the stage of development, if you go into Erickson's stage of development, it's a time in life where a six-year-old is becoming less egocentric, like self-focused, and they're actually starting to look at the world. They actually are starting to understand for the first time cause and effect. Like he's right there at that developmental stage. Well, cause and effect? Cause and effect is I lost two grandparents. Tragic, quickly my grandpa died. Okay, cause and effect. Okay, then I want to die. Because then I can be with them. Do you see how his brain is really trying to figure out how he can be with them again in his own little mind?

I think the candy, again, is reflective of I'm taking something and I'm going to hide it and I don't want you to take it away. He's trying to hold on to something. He's not being a bad kid, he's actually trying to get through this tragic loss. So I love the fact that you as parents are beginning to notice early on that this school therapist—and I love school therapists—but like you said, Dr. Alice, I think he needs a specialist and I would actually recommend that you see if there is someone in our group or someone through EMDRIA, e-m-d-r-i-a.org.

I would have you find an EMDR child therapist who's closest to you who is a consultant or certified in working with your son. Because there needs to be somebody that is going to get really deep into his heart to help him cathartically process what's got him stuck. I know there's a lot of kiddos that have loss like this and they move them through the stages of loss, but they do it using the EMDR, the bilateral stimulation, or even play therapy. But there's some amazing folks and sometimes we just have to go outside of traditional school therapy to somebody who's an expert in helping your son process what he's lost.

Alice: It can be so startling to hear a child say he wants to die and it might be the normal tendency to no, no you don't. Come on, no, no, that's not true. We want to shut that down because it's frightening and we don't know what to do with it. But allowing it to be understandable as his means of being back with the people he loves. I would be quick to listen and slow to correct that while also asking if he has thoughts of taking his own life because then we've got to be quick to move on that. But I'm not hearing that happening. And also helping him to see the purpose that God still has on his life and the way that he makes the world and his family a different place will help boost the protective factors of him acting against his life.

New Life: Would it be a good idea and we don't know the situation at the home, but maybe Pat's grandson has photos of his grandparents on the wall or just somewhere, would it be a good idea to make be taken them away from him so that he because it could be something that he walks by these photos and he sees them and then it just brings up these memories of "Wow, I can't be with them."

Sherry: I wouldn't. I wouldn't take them down. No because then you're kind of removing him. It's more of him being submerged in the reality of him missing them. And like you said, Alice, well, if you did die, you would be with them. And then what would that be like? Just letting him talk. Well, I get to see him again and I get to hug him again. I bet you really miss seeing him and hugging him. He might even have some artifacts or might even be something that he had with these grandparents, like sometimes it's a fishing pole or it's—grandparents can be those in—so if there's any kind of those items that maybe would have meaning for him, those are okay to have for him and hold on to. Leaning in and towards tends to be better than avoiding and turning a blind eye.

New Life: Pat, thank you so much for sending in your question on the radio page at newlife.com. newlife.com/radio gives you the email and the voicemail number that you can call in to submit your question. But we'd love to hear from you. In fact, tell your friends you've got someone who comes to mind right now that really needs our help. Call that person, text that person, tell them to call in. We're going to be in the studio for another hour. 1-800-229-3000 is our number. Renee and Gil will talk to you in a little bit.

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