New Life LIVE

Brian Perez: We made it to the weekend. Congratulations. This is New Life LIVE. I'm your host, Brian Perez. We've had a great week of shows. We had JJ and Mark here yesterday, and Jim and Sherry on Wednesday. And guess what? Jim and Sherry are back.

Sherry's a doctor of marriage and family therapy. Dr. Jim Burns is the founder of Homeward. We've got lots of godly wisdom and counsel headed our way for the next hour and some phone calls too. Colanisha, Isabelle, we'll get to all of you when we come back here on New Life LIVE. But Jim, why don't you start us off with some words of wisdom?

Jim Burns: You got it. Plus, I get to hang out with her twice, so I love it. And you too, Brian. Today I want to talk about one principle that people need to be thinking about. I actually in a previous broadcast just talked about this as well, but today I'm thinking about parents of adult children or even teens when the parents are heartbroken. Or there's something else going on in your family. I'm speaking this week in Austin, and I'm talking on complicated relationships.

Well, we all have complicated relationships, but a lot of times we have heartbreak. What do you do when your children have strayed from their faith? What do you do when they've violated your values? It can be at a young and a major thing or even a minor thing, but here's the principle. Lead with love. That's what Jesus did. He always led with love. Sherry, we had a conversation in a previous broadcast where you talked about that with Jason. You don't have to agree with someone to lead with love.

Jesus did that all the time. He didn't agree with the prostitute. He didn't agree with tax collectors. He didn't agree with some of the political and religious leaders, but he still led with love. I use a phrase a lot after I think of the word kindness matters when I need to lead with love, and it's just choose love and move forward. It's possible to choose love and move forward. That doesn't mean you have to agree with them.

I get my inspiration from God because he is the greatest example of showing love and kindness even when we blow it in our own lives. Throughout the Bible, we are reminded of God's unconditional, unfailing love. God says to us, and some of you need to hear this today, "I love you no matter how you are acting." Your actions and my love are totally different issues.

I think we have to do that with our own children. Sometimes we have to say if we pull back or we get angry and then we pout, well then they think, "You love me when I'm good and you don't love me when I'm bad." No, God loves us when we're good or bad, and we have to as parents do the same thing. Now we have to hold boundaries, hold consequences for actions and things.

It's an amazing thought here, but God loves us not for what we do but for who we are. We are his children. I love this in Romans 2:4, God's kindness is intended to lead you toward repentance. That's how we move toward wanting to be right people, full people. It's through God's kindness.

So as parents, if you happen to have an adult child who's strayed, it's not easy to show love in the midst of some of their poor decisions, but kindness may be the greatest impact and willingness in their life. Acceptance doesn't mean approval when you're leading with love. I love you for who you are, and I love you for where you are. Those are important things for us to learn, and we have an example in God.

Sherry: I just go preach. It's funny, not to throw a curveball into what you said, but I want to add a Lego onto that. It's interesting God's love for us, the very parental how Jesus modeled that. You're talking about being a parent and to lead with love.

What I'm thinking about is what do you do when it's your partner? Because you're talking about unconditional love, but when you're married to somebody and they're in the middle of an affair, that's when you don't lead with love, you lead with safety and you have some boundaries. Boundaries are loving.

Jim Burns: Boundaries and safety are actually loving. I think it's very possible to have a tough love. When we think of tough, we'll be angry or whatever. I think a tough love says allow them to experience some of the circumstances. So if there's terrible things that are happening with a partner, then I think we have to run to safety.

I think it's very important that we set up boundaries, but I don't see that as not love. To me, love is not just the feelings. Love sometimes is saying the only way for me to help you as an addict is to put on some boundaries here. And here's kind of how the boundaries are going to be, or the only way for me to show you deep love is to not allow porn or not allow these things to come into our home.

That's love because it's the only way that's going to help that relationship. Our definition of love, I think it's because of movies a lot of times, it's too much romance and all that, but there's a tougher love here. And there's a love when we have to say, "Do you hear your words? Do you understand what actions I'm taking? I'm taking this action out of love, and that is I'm running to safety right now."

Sherry: I have a Wonder Woman shield when I'm talking about boundaries. I use it all the time when I'm talking about boundaries because boundaries, I say often times when someone's hurting us, we want to take our shield and we want to bonk them over the head with it, which that's more punishment.

Boundaries, I say, are what's behind the shield. That's you. The Bible talks about guard your heart for it's the wellspring of life. Everything you do flows through it. When I've got the Wonder Woman shield up and I am thinking, what do I need to protect myself because this person's hurting me? That is a healthy boundary which is loving. It's loving you and it's creating a dilemma. It's creating something where they hit the shield and they slide down. But that's the impact of the harm.

Jim Burns: When we hear our pastors talk about unconditional love, sometimes we who can be codependent then join in almost a codependency that's actually not good because we're kind of coming in and trying to help them or we'll just be the doormat and let them run all over us. That's not going to help the relationship, and it's not the kind of love Jesus gave.

We see righteous anger. When Jesus sees children who are being hurt or abused, he's angry. Well, that even you can have a righteous anger and still show love, and that's what I think our God does. I think it's a broader definition. Very key and very important.

Brian Perez: Great conversation to start us off today on New Life LIVE. And now let's converse with you, beginning with Colanisha, who is calling in from San Diego, California. Welcome to New Life LIVE. Isabella, you'll be next, so don't hang up. Hello, Colanisha, how can we help you?

Colanisha: Hi, how are you doing? My issue was with my son who's 23, who's married to a girl that he met in foster care when they were about 14 years old. They were on and off since then. They got married about a year ago. It's been a toxic relationship from the beginning, and it's just gotten worse because now they've added two children.

So he's with me now. He's been with me for a couple days just to try to get away from that toxicity, but I don't know how to help him in the fact where he keeps running back to her even though he knows it's terrible. I'm just trying to get some guidance. I tried to get him into an eight-month program where it was a Christian place where he would go and try to get solace and get closer to God and just get away from all that mess that he's in.

But I'm just trying to find avenues to help him because he's heartbroken. He's really poured his whole heart into her, and it hurts me to see him constantly being broken by her. I call her the Black Widow because she literally just does everything in her power to destroy him. To destroy his soul, to destroy his manhood, to destroy his very being. But he loves her, and I'm like, that's not love. He doesn't want to step away, but it's like it's killing him. I'm just trying to see if you guys can offer some suggestions or some type of help.

Sherry: Do you know your son has an incredibly tender heart? He's got the heart of a rescuer. And he's had the heart of the rescuer since he was around 14 years old. I'm like, where did your boy get that? How did he see that? How was that modeled to him? Did he come into the world that way? Was he that kid that would rescue stray cats? Tell us a little bit about growing up for him.

Colanisha: So you're right. And he did tell me because she had a trauma where basically she was sexually abused by her biological father and he said that really struck him and he just wanted to protect her from that. So even though she's essentially killing him, he always feels like he has to be that protector for her that she never had. He's always had a kind heart.

Sherry: I'm going to share some stuff, it might not be what you want to hear, but let me just tell you what I have experienced in my small time here on this earth. So I had the opportunity to work six years with foster kids. And man, I learned a lot working with them.

And so when you said that she was sexually molested, sexually abused by her father, there is an incredible wound inside of her because somebody was her Black Widow. Somebody, her father, sucked the life out of her feeling safe. And so foster kids do something that I'm just going to say what I saw again and again. When it comes to attachment, they literally feel terror about deeply bonding with someone.

So here's your son's been somewhat of a kinsman redeemer and he's come into her life and he is loving her and she's like a feral cat, man. She is just scratching like you just want to he's trying to I have someone I know that had five feral cats outside her house. And over a period of months, she opened the door and put milk out. And then day after day after day.

And then one day she opened the door and they kind of came in. And then eventually she opened the door and the five cats came in and then she closed the door. Now, these cats have been domesticated and it's probably been 15 years now. I'm giving you that story, it's a parable. But these kids, when I was working with them on my caseload, as soon as they were falling in love, when I mean they were getting close to abandoning themselves to a human being, do you know what they did?

I had one kid empty liquid oil on the living room floor because the parents were about ready to adopt him. They were about ready to be his forever family. And this kid just didn't happen once, it happened many times. But what I learned is that's because of their wound. They have complicated attachment issues.

Now, what do you do with your boy when he is a rescuer and he is trying to help her heal? This is intensive work for them in therapy. These are like paradigms like emotionally focused therapy. Emotionally focused therapy is a type of therapy out there that takes trauma survivors and there's people that are certified.

I mean, I want you to find the best Navy Seal that does EFT in your area because Susan Johnson created this form of therapy for this type of relationship. And it's attachment. And there's therapists that are like Navy Seals that are able to go in the dark deep and they're able to point out what just happened there. "Ooh, look at you, but you really want her. Yes, I do, but I'm scared." And all these conversations that you think that they're not having because they don't even know how to have it.

You've got two little ones, little babies. Mama, Grandma, oh my goodness. I bet you like James, I bet you have calluses on your knees from praying, honestly. Because I hear your passion and you're trying to get your son safe, but I think what is happening is your fear is trying to get you polarized away from him. And he's not ready to leave.

And until he's ready to let go, he's going to fight. And then you're going to be polarized and you're triangulating yourself in and then he's like, "Mom!" right? So what I'm going to do is why don't you stand on the line. Jim's going to talk, but I'm just telling you, girl, I want you to find somebody who does emotionally focused therapy. There are a ton of people in San Diego that do that, EFT.

And I want you to pay if they can't afford, pay for some sessions. Get on their team and see if a really good treatment professional can help to get into the mechanics of the trauma response that she's doing because of her sexual abuse and who knows what else happened.

Jim Burns: I would simply add it's interesting because I think what you just got from Sherry is beautiful and right. What I want you to hear on that is she used the word triangulate. And you have a mother's love and a grandma's love that's deep and wonderful.

You got to make sure that you don't put your agenda with that boy of yours because he's not ready to leave her. He may need and yet you have these two grandkids and he has these two kids. He's going to be with this woman for co-parenting children for all of their life. And so you got to make sure that he does get the kind of help that he needs.

And I find a lot of times that moms have a harder time discerning because it's their baby boy. You know him, you experience him, you don't want him to hurt. But he's going to have to go through some kind of a situation. And my feeling is you don't start with the eight-month program. Maybe you start with what Sherry is talking about and maybe just with him and help him get the help he needs. And then he welcomes this woman into it or whatever it might be. Now, they may need the eight-month thing, but the truth is that you maybe start with a baby step that's good and healthy for him. He gets it and then he kind of moves farther, that might be easier.

Brian Perez: Colanisha, thank you so much for calling in today from San Diego. We appreciate hearing your story and we hope that what Jim and Sherry just shared will really help you in your situation. Thank you for caring for your son and your two grandbabies and their mom as well. Thanks for calling in. We are going to take a quick break and then we'll go back to the phones. Isabella, we're going to talk to you next right here on New Life LIVE, so don't hang up everyone else, hang on, we'll be right back.

Brian Perez: Let's bring Isabella into the conversation. She watches us on YouTube in Washington, D.C. Welcome, Isabella, let's wave to her. Hi there. Welcome to the show.

Isabella: Hi, I don't know where to start. This is a really important conversation to me and I think it's going to help somebody else too. Specifically I'm calling to talk to Sherry, and the last call opened up something really interesting that I didn't intend.

But I was calling specifically because I called into one of your counselors to see if I could speak with a woman to see if I could get some advice about coming to Restore. Because I'm married to a man that went to Every Man's Battle because he's got lots of issues and when he got out of Every Man's Battle, he was stranger than when he went in because he was officially diagnosed by a psychiatrist with narcissistic personality disorder, not just narcissism. And it just made him more proud of himself that he had this new identity and it's just been even worse.

The situation being, I feel like I could use Restore but I wanted to ask Sherry. When I called in about six months ago I got Stacy and Lara on the phone and they were really concerned about my situation and my husband sounded like the bad guy. And he is, he's the bad guy. But my situation is that, and I want everybody to hear this in case there's a woman or man out there that needs to.

The Holy Spirit was telling me a few times in the four or five years that my husband and I were spending time together as best friends, close soulmates, etc., not to marry him. Still small voice, quiet, peaceful, don't marry him. And God knew the sadness and torment that it would cause me because my husband had incredible sexual issues that I had no way of knowing because he was lying to me. Because as a Christian I wouldn't have known that he wasn't normal and that he was heavily addicted to masturbation and pornography and all kinds of God only knows what.

So when we got married, I found out the hard way on the honeymoon and I've been traumatized ever since. But I was traumatized anyway because my husband's extremely abusive, because of the NPD, and he's emotionally and verbally abusive, but he's a sweet guy on the outside like everybody loves him. "Oh, him? He has narcissistic personality disorder?" I say, not narcissism, narcissistic personality disorder, it's different.

I spent my whole life like this. Meanwhile, my life at home is torturous. We have no real relationship, we're like buddies. It's been 40 years, and the Lord's been I believe the Lord's been telling me for quite a few years now to leave. And our pastor when we first got married told me to get an annulment because I'd been defrauded and I wasn't able to do it because I have an unhealthy attachment to him.

And here I am all these years later, I just don't know what to do. So I'm very abused and he can't help it and I'm at fault too. Like the other reason that we shouldn't have got married is because God knew that I wouldn't be nice to him back. I'm not a saint. I mean, I am, but so I just wanted to know if I'm going to come to Restore to try to work some of these things through and find out what God really wants me to do in this situation, how on earth do I tell a man like this that I'm going to be away for three days? That I have to spend some money? That I have to take an airplane? I mean, do you know what I'm going to go through when I tell him? It's already hard enough to talk to him about anything.

I just don't know what to do. So I called one of the counselors, they said, "Can I talk to one of the women who do Restore to ask how do I tell him?" If the Lord really wants me to go, do I just sneak away? Do I pretend? Do I lie? So here's my question. But I think these other issues like what you talked about at the beginning of the show and what you talked about with this mom about the emotionally damaged human beings who walk themselves into these situations, hello, here I am.

Sherry: Oh, girl, you've been with him how long? How many years have you been married? 40. Isabella, I think my hope would be to peel back some of your shame regarding how you're behaving with him because you're dealing with two things. You're dealing with the impact of betrayal trauma and, yes, of course, Restore would be good for you.

In fact, we have a one-day that's coming up virtual Thursday, the 26th of February. That would be a very safe way you could put your foot in the water and kind of get a feel for some of the benefits that you would get. And then you can decide then about going in person.

But the reason that Stacy and Lara were both concerned for you is because they're picking up on the very same thing that I'm picking up on is you're not just dealing with somebody who has a compulsive sexual issue, a porn addiction, a sex addiction, some kind of problematic sexual behavior. You're dealing with somebody that's got a personality disorder.

And so commonly with that, there's an integrity abuse disorder that goes along with that, and there's emotional abuse, psychological abuse, gaslighting, Darvo, there's like a whole other world of impact. And so someone like yourself who's dealing with that combination, you probably feel more isolated and alone. You probably feel like even some betrayed partners may not fully understand what you're dealing with with the damage.

And because of the pathology, because of the chronic abuse, they basically it's like they gut your soul out. They disembody you. He's spent his four decades trying to make you dependent, trying to get you to a place where you'll never leave him because of the threats.

And if you think back, you think back to all the things he's alluded to, the things he's said, the things he's done, how disempowering he's been financially. Like you just want to go buy something at Walmart and you get all the negative, all the angry, "You can't do that, I'm the one that has the money here and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah." And then so what does that teach you? What that teaches you is like, "I can't do that, I can't push back because he gets angry." That's all the abuse.

So when I'm thinking about you, Isabella, I thought about, and you can go online to see this, but in some places in the world where there are elephants, people grow up and they put a rope around a baby elephant and they tie it to a little stake in the ground. Now, you know what that baby elephant learns when it's itty bitty in the early stages of that relationship? It can't pull away from that little stake.

And it's conditioned again and again and again, and it can't tug away, can't tug away. Well, you know what? When that elephant gets to be, you know, two tons, guess what's holding them to a stake? The same rope. That's learned helplessness. That's abuse. That's the damage that's been done to you by him because of his personality disorder. Even though the elephant can easily break through that.

Now you might be saying, "Wait a second, Sherry, you're talking about this like you don't know my husband." And I'm like, let me tell you something. I know abuse and I know the scariest thing in the world is for you to get to a point where you develop a safety plan, an exit strategy. Like I would not leave him until you have your ducks in a row and you have made it's called a safety plan, an exit strategy.

You've worked with a therapist to empower you because guys like this, when you go to leave, you will experience the wrath. You will. It's predictable. They will try to annihilate you because narcissists like this level destroy what they can't control. Now will you be destroyed? No. But you're going to need a safe place to go. You're going to need friends, you're going to need family, you're going to need support. You're going to need your Restore sisters. You're going to need a whole bunch of people around you that get the abuse that you're in so that you can have a safe place to get disengaged.

Isabella: Okay, so I got to get connected to the Restore community. Yes. Uh-huh. Now that's a little different than what you're saying because he's not the helpless type. He's the type that wants me to be the boss. It's much worse because I hate being the boss. He had a very demanding mother. So it's a different version, but I'm hearing the same thing.

Sherry: But think about this, girl. He's still projecting a role onto you. So if you're supposed to be the boss, why can't you just take your stake out and walk away? I want you to hear me. If you're the boss in the relationship, girl, what is keeping your stake in the ground? Why can't you just go to Restore, spend the money? Tell me, what's the dilemma?

Isabella: Oh no, it's that the time leading up to it will be torture. Like what do I trauma So are you the boss? Are you the boss? The boss is different. It's like remember that phrase, an imperative person? He wants me to be an imperative person. I'm supposed to create our entire planet. It's supposed to be my imperatives. Do this, do that, don't do this, don't do that. It's hell for me. It's not my personality.

Sherry: But I want you to see that his projection is the boss of you. And you need to get your identity. You need to get your strength back. You need to get your support. And I'm so glad to hear you're going to go to Restore. Look at the decision was made here.

Isabella: Well, let me explain. So that's exactly it's getting to the heart of what I wanted to ask. So the thing is if I let him know, "I have to work on this, I'm in a lot of pain. I told you I made a big mistake years ago and this is a painful relationship for me. I want to talk to some women."

Then he gets proud of himself. See the NPD and the cluster, he gets proud of himself that his wife's going through a separation. His wife's going through a divorce. And then he gets abusive about that. So he's like a bad child.

Sherry: So what is it about you that doesn't have boundaries for your own soul, your boundary for your body? It hurts so bad when he does it. I know. So guess what? You know what a boundary is? Boundary looks like this. "Hey, I'm going to take a little trip." "Well, where are you going?" "Ah, I just want to take a trip and take some time for myself. I just need to get away and reflect."

That's a boundary. You're not lying to him. You're protecting yourself. But then I get the excuse the expression, the F-U attitude. Like I got to live with the F-U attitude from him. The pain is just too much. I get it. That's because of the abuse.

So I want you to stand on the line. I'm going to have Jim talk to you, but this is the fear of why you're not wrong for being afraid. You're afraid for a reason. But eventually fear means I mean, I have a sign up in my house that says John Wayne says, "Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway."

And eventually you will need to garner enough strength to get out, but I want you to have a plan because I hear it in you. I hear your vulnerability and he plays on that. But you need to get really healthy and whole and you're vulnerable. You're trauma-bonded possibly to him. Or you might not be trauma-bonded, but you're just dismembered by the abuse.

But stand on the line, we're going to get you hooked into a really good counselor here at New Life and then we're going to get you into Restore, and I'm sure Jim has some amazing wisdom for you. But we're for you. We see you. You're not in trouble. There's nothing I want to peel the shame back because we often feel like there's something wrong with me. Well, let me tell you, something wrong has been happening to you for four decades and of course you're feeling weakened by that.

Jim Burns: We don't have much time, but I do want to say, the reason I was asking about does she have a plan is because, and again, we have plans. I have a diet plan. I'm not carrying it through right now. So you could have a plan and it not work.

But it seems to me that she's got to develop this safety plan, and one of the parts of the plan would be to go to Restore. And that's only part of it because somebody's going to have to help her make some decisions. She's been abused for 40 years. I felt that as you were talking, Sherry. The impact of what her situation has been.

So she may not have the ability to do this on her own. She may need a circle of what I call a circle of support of people who can kind of help her do that, and that's definitely going to be a therapist. It could be her, somebody in pastoral care. It could be one of her best friends. It could be some people who are kind of behind her to help her get to that safety plan and actually hold her accountable to it.

And I would want to make sure that the abuse that she's so talking about, but she's so afraid of is, I mean, verbal abuse is just the same, but if there was some physical abuse, she needs to get out of there right now and get to a domestic violence shelter. And they would have tons of them where she lives. And none of them are perfect and none of them are the Ritz Carlton, but they are going to bring her safety.

But it seems to me that she's got to be able to kind of get this map. I didn't sense she knew it totally. She has to get this kind of map to give her some direction. But please, if you're in an abusive situation for 40 years, and I can only imagine, I think we only got to just a little bit.

Restore's going to be great for her. It's a breakthrough, but it's not the only answer. She's going to then have to be in that with a therapist who can help her. Lean on them. I mean, that's why they're there. That's why you went to school. That's what you do. That's what you live for. I'm looking at you, Sherry.

You've helped a lot of people find freedom, but it didn't happen overnight. And I'll be honest with you, sometimes in a counseling situation it works and other times people say, "Well, I'm going to go back into this." I hope she gets the plan together. That's the only way to help this even survive if it was going to survive.

Dave Stoop, who used to be a part of this, used to say, "If the horse is dead, get off the horse." And what he meant to say was if the thing is don't stay in the smell. Get some help. That's when you can kind of be restored, if you would.

I strongly suggest Restore because Restore will give her the tools if she doesn't have them. And if she hasn't read your book, Intimate Deception, then she needs to read it. I would suggest she read that book because I'm sensing there's a lot more betrayal than we even talked about in terms of her own life with this guy. But I understand it because it's so painful for her to make the courageous move. Find that safety plan.

Sherry: Yeah, it's interesting, I write notes when I'm on the show and I don't know if y'all can see it, but if you can, this is Isabella, right? There's just so much that's there and that's hard to unpack.

But the two books I would have you get, Isabella, is mine, Intimate Deception: Healing the Wounds of Sexual Betrayal. And then I would also have you get Leslie Vernick's book, The Emotionally Destructive Marriage. And then I would have you get one more book, let me tell you three. You can get these at many of them at our store at New Life. It's Not You by Dr. Ramani.

And Dr. Ramani is a narcissist specialist. She's out there, does podcasts and all of that. And I think that they'll be some really good information. When I'm working with trauma survivors that are trauma survivors of narcissistic personality disorder, and especially when there's because of the entitlement, it's very common that they sexually act out because they just believe they can.

It's like they're not really thinking of you. And you were once the target that they were pursuing when they were love-bombing you and idealizing you, but they're always on the hunt for a target. And so the target could be pornography, the target could be the woman at Home Depot that works there, the target could be somebody they work with, the target could be a neighbor, the target could be a family member.

There's layers of narcissism. There's somebody that has narcissistic traits. That's very different than somebody who has narcissistic personality disorder. And there's a DSM, you can go out there and say what are the features of somebody who has NPD or narcissistic personality disorder.

But then there's another layer, and that's the Cluster B category. That's about 7%. There's four: there's narcissistic personality, histrionic personality, borderline personality, and antisocial personality. So these four kind of get combined and it's like a Big Gulp super-sized. So if there's the narcissistic personality disorder and there's antisocial parts of that combination, then what happens is there's a narcissist who's looking for opportunities and targets, but then there's this "gotcha." There's this antisocial pleasure that they kind of get off on the harm that they are hurting you.

And so again, it's very real. It's very sad, Isabella. I hear you. And partners like yourself, I just want you to be kind to yourself because it can take some weeks and months to get clearheaded about all of this. And clarity is kindness. Like going to Restore, getting in to talk about what's happened to you in the betrayal, having a safe place with a therapist, doing some of your own reading so that even if there's someone at Restore that doesn't have your story, it's okay because there are other women there that also have abuse going on. And so you just work on you.

One thing I want to say in your vulnerability, I can tell that you feel the need to have to tell him what you're doing and when you're doing it. This call today, girl, is not something for you to talk with him about. The work that you're doing is not something to talk to him about.

Now why am I saying that? Because if somebody is abusing you and you tell them what you're learning, they will weaponize it against you to harm you. I guarantee it. So I have to be really frank and direct with people that are being abused to say this is for you. This is for your ears, this is for your heart. This is not for you to tell the abuser because you're going to be hurt, and sometimes they're even more angry. So you protect yourself. You got to learn to be wise as a serpent, gentle as a dove. You just get safe.

Brian Perez: So these three resources that Sherry mentioned you can read on the plane ride from Washington, D.C. to Dallas. That is when the Restore: Healing After Betrayal intensive is happening the weekend of March 6th. Two weeks from now. And today is the last day to sign up for the early bird discount. You can do that at newlife.com or by calling 1-800-NEW-LIFE.

And if you've experienced betrayal through a spouse, partner, parent, friend, or someone you deeply trusted, you know that it's one of the deepest wounds a person can experience. It can make you feel confused, angry, numb, stuck. New Life walks with people through these painful places toward real healing.

We have a faith-based webinar coming up next week, February 26th, Thursday, 7:00 p.m. Central Time. That's for men and women, and it offers them practical guidance, biblical encouragement, and clear next steps for navigating betrayal. If you'd like more information on this webinar and a free tips sheet, text the word "webinar" to 28950.

And the Restore: Healing After Betrayal intensive that's happening a week later, the weekend of March 6th in Dallas. And we love hearing from you guys. Thank you so much for praying for us, for praying for our listeners, and for supporting us financially. If you haven't become a 99 for 1 partner yet, find out more about that at newlife.com. God bless you guys. We'll see you at church on Sunday and we'll talk to you here on Monday.

Becky Brown: Hello, it's Becky Brown. I am so excited to launch our 99 for 1 partner initiative. Every day we hear from people all over the world who are looking for hope. They've been lost in a relationship struggle, addiction, anxiety, depression, all kinds of ways.

And it reminds us of the story in Luke 15 where the shepherd leaves the 99 to go rescue the one. And you know, we've seen God work in the lives of so many people over the years here at New Life, and we want to invite you to be part of what God is doing. 99 for 1 is our partner program that you can give to the ministry on a monthly basis to make sure that we continue to reach out to the lost. Call 1-800-NEW-LIFE, 1-800-639-5433 or newlife.com/99for1.