Save America Ministries

Chuck Crismier: Iran boasts Islam could rule the world as the Trump deal eludes the United States. A top Iranian commander declared last Saturday that Iran's performance in its nearly six-month war with the United States had demonstrated the power of Islam, as the Trump Administration continues to struggle to translate overwhelming American military superiority into lasting settlement.

Ahmad Vahidi, who heads Iran's powerful Islamic Revolutionary Guards, praised the IRGC, army police, and Basij forces for supposedly bringing, as he said, the most heavily armed army in the history of the world to its knees. Vahidi claimed Iran's resistance had demonstrated that, quote, "Islam could be made to rule the world," unquote.

That is exactly the intent, that was exactly the intent of the 1979 Islamic Revolution, in which Louis Farrakhan traveled from his country over to meet with Mr. Rajani, the then President, and declared that Iran was the vanguard of the Islamic Revolution. Then we have this headline. Iran's Supreme Leader's fate shrouded in mystery.

He's disappeared almost completely from public view, fueling growing speculation that he may be seriously ill or dead. It raised fresh questions about who is actually running the Islamic Republic. That came out yesterday from The Atlantic.

Then this came in response from Israel National News. Trump says Mr. Khamenei is very seriously wounded but not dead. He has serious wounds to the left side of his body but is likely still alive, and praises U.S. military and navy operations and predicts a very big victory. So is he dead or is he alive?

Well, we don't know, but here's what we do know, that the Iranian church is not dead. In fact, it's alive, but you can't see it above ground because it's underground. And so today on Viewpoint, we're going to be talking about that and I'm glad that you've joined us. This conversation is always with ever-increasing conviction, talk that transforms. Will Iran rule the world under Islam?

Well, you can just as soon ask the question whether Turkey will rule the world because Mr. Erdogan intends to do so under another version of Islam. So it seems that Islam has an intent to rule the world. But here's the interesting thing. There is one in history who declared that he would be the ruler of the world. In fact, already is. His name is Jesus Christ, Yeshua HaMashiach, and it appears that the fastest growing church in the world is not the Crystal Cathedral, it's not the biggest churches in America, it's not even Korean, South Korean churches that are now floundering. It's in Iran, underground churches.

So joining us today on Viewpoint, I am specially privileged to introduce to you Lana Silk. She was an Iranian citizen, and she is here in the United States of America, and she has formed an organization called Transform Iran. She is the CEO of the information, of the organization Transform Iran, and talking about the remarkable growth of the underground church. Her own testimony, we're going to hear about that here on the program today. We're going to hear about, you know, her parents and so on. We're going to hear about what Transform America, excuse me, Transform Iran is doing.

This is, you know, the world, friends, is not all about America. Believe it or not. That may sound strange to you, but actually God is looking after people all over the world, and He counts those that are following Him and His son as our brothers and sisters. So we have two kingdoms. We have the kingdoms of this world, and then we have the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and it appears that the Kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ is growing in Iran. Shocking but true. Lana, it's good to have you on the program.

Lana Silk: Thank you so much. What a wonderful introduction. I'm excited for our conversation.

Chuck Crismier: Well, thank you. You know, it is pretty exciting when you think of it. I'm looking at your picture here as a courageous woman. I do believe that anyone coming out of Iran is courageous. Back in the 1950s, an aunt and uncle of mine were actually Medicare, medical missionaries to Iran under the Shah. And, yeah, they were, and their children suffered a great deal as a result of it because there was nothing available, no milk was available. Their kids' teeth suffered and fell out of their heads. But in any event, they finally came to the States. I'm not sure what motivated them to come to the States because it was before the Islamic Revolution, but indeed, that's my connection to Iran. What's yours?

Lana Silk: Well, I was born in Iran. I was born on a day that Iranians called Black Friday in September '78.

Chuck Crismier: Now, wait a minute, wait a minute. That was in 1978 Black Friday. You know we had a Black Friday here in America?

Lana Silk: Yes, on Black Friday. Oh, no.

Chuck Crismier: It was Black Monday. That's when the stock market crashed.

Lana Silk: Oh, I didn't know about that. I thought you were making a joke about the sales after Thanksgiving. Okay, so you had Black Friday. Yes.

Chuck Crismier: Yes, yes.

Lana Silk: Yes, so this is the day in September '78 that I guess coming up to millions of Iranians really protested, took to the streets. Many died, there was a lot of violence, fighting and protesting to turn their secular monarchy into an Islamic theocracy. And that happened to be the day that the Lord chose to bring me into this world, and so all I've ever known is what came after that. I was at school under that regime. It was, you know, I was still a child when we left. I was just coming up to my 10th birthday when we left the country. So I was not, I was old enough to remember it, and I have many memories from Iran, but too young really to understand the gravity of the oppression.

Chuck Crismier: So you were really born into the revolution itself?

Lana Silk: I was. Yes, I was.

Chuck Crismier: Unbelievable.

Lana Silk: Yeah. Yeah, very, very Islamic world, you know, from every angle they were actively brainwashing, manipulating, glorifying the Islamic martyrs and Jihad on the murals on the walls and their Islamic leadership. My school uniform was a chador. I had to be covered head to toe, even as a five-year-old. It was, yeah, a very oppressive environment. An environment in which I was privileged to, I'm so happy I've experienced it, and I can speak to it. But also, my parents are God-loving, spirit-filled Christians, and I was, so I was brought up knowing Jesus. In fact, my mom tells a story of having to pull me off the balcony for our apartment in Tehran because as a sort of seven-ish-year-old, I was standing there on the balcony preaching to the passersby that Jesus was the only way and that. And she had to drag me in pretty quick.

Chuck Crismier: Wow, so you were a John the Baptist for your time.

Lana Silk: I was, I was a bit of a fiery evangelist. Yes.

Chuck Crismier: Well, it sounds like my mother used to say about me when I was six, walking up and down the streets of Detroit, singing, "To reclaim was He," right out of the, you know, a hymn. Well, God calls people to lift up their voice, and certainly you've done that.

Lana Silk: He does. He does. And you know, when you get to know God, when you truly experience Him, I don't believe anything is a barrier, whether it's age or language or culture or geography. When you've experienced Jesus, you understand what a precious prize He is, and there is something in all of us that wants to share good news.

Chuck Crismier: That's what we're doing here today on the program right after this break. All right, friends, stay tuned.

Chuck Crismier: Growing Iran's underground church under the Islamic regime's tyranny. That's what our special guest is striving to do, Lana Silk, here today on Viewpoint. She came to the United States and left Iran just 10 years into the Islamic Revolution, and things could not have been looking very good at that time. We want to find out what she experienced then and how her family actually was able to escape Iran, and then we'll see, we're going to hear from her own mouth what she sees as happening in Iran underground.

You know, a lot of things happened underground, friends. The whole Chinese church is developed underground. And now they're trying to ferret it out. The Chinese government is going after the pastors of house churches to ferret them out and destroy all of the leadership, and yet, the church is still growing. Wow. Who would have ever thunk it? Lana Silk joining us. Lana, you came to the States when you were 10, is that right?

Lana Silk: We actually went to England first. So I had my growing, the rest of my growing up in England and we moved to the States five years ago with my family.

Chuck Crismier: Okay. And are you a citizen yet, or what?

Lana Silk: I am green card holder at this point.

Chuck Crismier: All right, so you're just a green citizen. You're in the growing stage.

Lana Silk: I am a want to be citizen.

Chuck Crismier: Well, good for you. Good for you. You're a want-to-be American, but you're already a real Christian. So you don't have to be an American to be a follower of Jesus Christ, do you?

Lana Silk: That's right. That's my citizenship. You know, we have, we've had a wonderful opportunity with our move to help our children, grasp what is it, what it is to be a citizen of heaven, you know. They've experienced culture shock. Would you believe it from England to the States? But it is very different. I can tell you that. And we've had all sorts of discussions, my daughter was nine when we moved and then my sons were 12 and 14. And, you know, there's a lot, you know what children are like. This is how it's done. This is the culture, this is. And it's, it's wonderful for me to be able to say, I'm an Armenian in ethnicity, Iranian in my core and early years, and my husband is British, and it's nice to be able to turn my children and say, listen, you are no more American than you are British, than you are Armenian, than you are Iranian. None of that matters.

Chuck Crismier: In other words, you're all mixed up.

Lana Silk: Well, no, but you are called to the singular thing. You are a citizen of heaven. All of this is secondary. Your culture is the culture of heaven.

Chuck Crismier: There you go. Exactly. So you went to not so jolly old England, and tell us just briefly what you experienced there in England because my perception of what's happening in the UK is not pretty. In fact, the, the churches are being turned either into bars or mosques. What say you?

Lana Silk: Yeah. It's, you know what? I think it is a, the US is a large country, so every expression is more exaggerated in that. You know, you might only have 10% of the population believe a certain thing, but that's a lot more people than you'd have if you were 10% of England. So I think in some way it is a similar reflection. We, there are some very wonderful, thriving, growing churches in England. There are awakenings happening in pockets, people are turning to the Lord, but there's also an extremely secular side and a very vocal secular side that wants to stamp that kind of what they would consider intolerance out of their society.

Lana Silk: You know, the, the, the kind of movements that are all about seeking out those that are different and keeping the country pure and, and judging people based on the color of their skin. There's, there's a lot of that going on in England too.

Chuck Crismier: Well, then you've got a mayor.

Lana Silk: Islam has great roots.

Chuck Crismier: You've got a mayor of one of the largest cities in the world, the financial center of the world, London, that was chosen by the Brits to be their mayor. He's a Muslim. And then we have in America,

Lana Silk: That's right.

Chuck Crismier: The largest city in America, New York, chose an Islamic,

Lana Silk: That's right.

Chuck Crismier: How do you, what do you make of this?

Lana Silk: Oh, Chuck, it's, I just think, well, we are, oh, we are so lost. We're so very lost. Look, we, there is a natural tendency in our heart to want to be, and rightly, to want to be inclusive, loving, and make space for people to express themselves, and all those good things. But we mustn't allow that to create a naivete in us. There are millions of wonderful, peace-loving, kind Muslim people, but Islam is not peaceful, kind, and loving. We have to separate those two things. And there are many Muslims who wouldn't, wouldn't agree to the full depth of the teaching that you can pull out of the Quran. But there, there is a very strong Islamic agenda that is absolutely laser-focused on invading from within in the West, taking over our democracies, and that is, that is just the way that it is. And those, those that would argue against it are, are not informed.

Chuck Crismier: What do you say of the what's going down there in McKinney, Texas, just north of Dallas, where they're trying to form a complete Islamic city, and they just had plans that were approved by the City Council or whatever for a 3,000-person Islamic mosque. Is this something that you approve of in the name of plurality? What, what are your thoughts?

Lana Silk: No, I do not. You know what's interesting about that story, if I'm not mixing up my stories, is there was a lot of local dissatisfaction with these plans and the population turned up to bring their opposition to the plans at the local Town Council meeting, and to try to get this thing overturned. But you know, the, those with this agenda played a long game. They deliberately joined school boards and local councils and places of authority. And the fact that the vote was unanimous, didn't matter how many people turned up and said, this isn't good for our society. We don't want Sharia law here. We don't. It didn't matter. The people with the power were pro-Islam and brought it in. And I am, I am concerned, but not terribly concerned because I know who sits on His throne. Um, but I do have a concern that we are allowing things to slide out of ignorance and not being courageous with the truth.

Chuck Crismier: All right, Lana, you brought your kiddos over here, they first experienced their life in the UK, in Britain. And then they come here, they saw what was happening, the deterioration, what was happening in Britain. And when they came here, what was their reaction?

Lana Silk: Well, what I've learned since moving here, Chuck, is America is a very big country, and the culture is not, you can't just say, this is America. There are pockets and changes all over. We happen to live in a pretty small town in Ohio, and we don't experience a lot of what you read in the news right where we live. It's almost Bible Belt Southern kind of feel.

Chuck Crismier: Well, unless you lived in Dearborn, Michigan.

Lana Silk: Well, that would have been different. That would have been close to what I experienced in Iran. I mean, this is what really, I think, my goodness. All we have to look at is what Iran was like in the '70s, the freedoms they enjoyed, and the way they fought to bring in Islam. And we're doing the same thing here. And now the same people in Iran who fought and died to allow Islam the kind of roots that it took in their country are now buckling underneath and dying, and now fighting and dying to overthrow it. And here we are inviting it into our country.

Chuck Crismier: All right. So, what do you make of the fact that the Shah was deposed? Supposedly he was a friend of the West. But the Muslim fundamentalists despised him for that. Is that why they got rid of him? Why did they get rid of him? Because if he was just despotic, they didn't get anything better with Khomeini.

Lana Silk: Well, there are a lot of layers to the events that ended up in the Shah's deposing. It wasn't all a bed of roses. He lived a very opulent life. He threw very extravagant parties. There was poverty in Iran. Khomeini's big winning argument was social justice. And that is one of the tenets of Islam, you know, helping the poor, giving aid to the poor. And so there was a lot of preaching around Islam is peaceful, it brings justice, it seeks mercy. And so this is what we need because, look, these secular Westerners in bed with America have done this to our country, and we need to come back to our roots. That kind of rhetoric that caught people's attention.

Chuck Crismier: All right. But when you look at the other Muslim countries there in the Middle East, the Arab countries and other Muslim countries, all of their leaders are wealthy and live a high life beyond anything that anybody else could imagine, even the leaders of Hamas were living in Qatar, or Qatar, and living on the hog while the people in Gaza were being destroyed and hungry. How do you make, it seems to me there's a lot of confusion between what Islam really stands for.

Lana Silk: Oh, absolutely. Yeah, there is the official line and then there's the reality. Um, the difference with the Shah situation in Iran was he wasn't, he wasn't openly oppressing his people. He wasn't beating people down if they deviated. You know, the examples you're bringing are controlling leadership, you know. We didn't have that in Iran at the time. We certainly do now. And you know, Iran's leadership is very wealthy. Iran is a wealthy country, very wealthy country, and yet the people are struggling to put food on the table. That is a pattern. Um, there is, there's a popular version of Islam. You know, people can talk about extremism in Iran, Islamic fundamentalists, and I would say, well, I don't know how much they're extremist and how much they're authentic, you know. There's, there's teachings that they're following pretty closely.

Chuck Crismier: Right. Okay. Now, let's, let's go to Christians, Christianity, how Christians are treated. I have in my hands here a very lengthy article that came from a woman by the name of Marzeah, Morazadi. And she became an American citizen 10 years ago. She came from Iran, the country of her birth. She became a Christian in 1999, was arrested and sentenced to death for the crime of apostasy.

Chuck Crismier: So you gives a long story about this. Is that what you understand Christians are dealing with there in Iran?

Lana Silk: Oh, yes, absolutely. I know many people who've been through that experience. It, it is illegal for people to turn from Islam, and particularly frowned upon for them to turn to Christianity. Christians are called Zionists, they're pro-Israel, and so there's a political layer there as well. They get accused of being a threat to national security, they're tortured, they're executed, imprisoned, their property taken from them. It's systematic control and oppression to try to wipe out the church.

Chuck Crismier: Over 50 people have been executed this month alone in Iran. There's no country in the world that does this. How do they, how do they explain this in terms of the representation that Islam is a religion of peace and love?

Lana Silk: You know, the Iranian government is no longer trying to play those kinds of PR games for Islam. That's happening in other countries, and particularly Western countries. They're not, they're not attempting to, they talk about Islam as a country, sorry, a religion of dominance, how it is their God-given call to not only practice Sharia law correctly in their own country, but to export it to other countries and ensure others submit to it by force if necessary. So that kind of rhetoric isn't, isn't coming out of the Iranian government. And when they execute so many people, they, they're not trying very hard to justify it. I mean, there have been executions that have happened with no one informed. We've had stories of mothers being called up and told that their son was executed and they disposed of the body. You can go find it if you like. That kind of language. They're not playing games anymore.

Chuck Crismier: Okay. Now, there's a, there's a word that is used in Islam that I think just is baffling to Americans. In fact, anybody in Western culture, is taqiyya. I think that's how you pronounce it, taqiyya. Explain to our listeners what taqiyya is and how it's used.

Lana Silk: So taqiyya is really about wartime and how you behave and what is acceptable for you to do when you're under some kind of threat. You know, it's,

Chuck Crismier: In other words, you can lie, cheat, or steal, you can do whatever you have to do in order to accomplish the goal of Islam ruling the world.

Lana Silk: Yes. So purists in Islam will say that that is only acceptable under threat or under duress. But then they would struggle to argue that they're not in that position right now. Uh, but it absolutely is concealing your true religious identity, even concealing your beliefs, anything that avoids you coming to harm. Look, Chuck, if you have a Christian who's been identified as a Christian and they've been told, right, we're going to kill you now, unless you denounce your faith. We know what we celebrate is the honorable thing to do there is, is to be martyred for your, you refuse to denounce your faith. Jesus is Lord, I don't care what you do to me.

Chuck Crismier: All right.

Lana Silk: Muslims will not look at that as something honorable. They will look at that as something weak. That is a classic situation for taqiyya. They would say, this is crazy. It was, it would be the right thing to do would be for you to lie and say that you have denounced your faith because what's good in you dying? That's one less Muslim to further the cause. You're better to come out of that situation and fight another day.

Chuck Crismier: All right, that translates. Now, we have to make a segue into the whole issue of what Christians are enduring there in Iran, and how that figures in your efforts to transform Iran into a Christian community. We've got to get to the brass tax on this and we will.

Chuck Crismier: Our guest today, Lana Silk, who is, was born in Iran, right there on the eve of the Islamic Revolution. She was there until 10 years of age, in which her family then escaped to the UK. And then she imported herself to the United States of America five years ago. And here she is standing strong, having formed a organization called Transform Iran, to somehow lift up the underground church in Iran to encourage us in the West as to how to respond, how to understand what God is doing, not what she is doing, but what God is doing, and then what perhaps you and I can do about it. So, we talk about faith that flourishes under pressure, Lana. Is there, what can Western Christians learn from the Iranian church?

Lana Silk: The Iranian church has understood the value of the gospel. They are prepared to live and die for it. They're prepared to take risks for it. They're prepared to be uncomfortable, unpopular, set aside whatever it takes. It is absolutely fine because Jesus is better than anything they can have on earth.

Chuck Crismier: In other words, they understand that persecution is endemic to what it means to be a Christian.

Lana Silk: Yes, but also just, just a prioritization, you know. When we have access to a comfortable, easy life, we can slip into a spiritual coma. But when we're under pressure, and we have to make life-or-death decisions and constantly be deciding, am I going to choose Jesus, or am I going to choose comfort? Am I going to choose Jesus, or am I going to choose life? Then we get to decide what's important. And, and Jesus, there is no lukewarm Christianity in Iran. You know that it's going to cost you. But people in Iran have experienced Him, and they're happy to follow Him at all costs.

Chuck Crismier: The whole concept of the cost of discipleship just doesn't resonate much with American Christians. It just doesn't. Especially with our young people. They don't get it. It's not even relevant. They don't understand, can't even understand, it seems, and so what we're actually doing is inculcating in them a completely false understanding of what it means to follow Christ. And if indeed things are going to get rougher and rougher, as Jesus said, that if they persecuted me, they're going to persecute you, why do you think you should be different than your Lord? Then people are radically unprepared. But what you're saying is, the underground church in Iran are prepared because this is how they're being born again.

Lana Silk: Yes, exactly. I mean, there's that famous quote, I forget who says it, is what you're living, living for, sorry, is what you are living for, worth dying for? You know, we, we have to understand that our, the gospel that we follow is worth dying for, and then we live for it differently. Chuck, every mission field has its challenges. The challenge that we have here in the US is the sort of the enemy is comfort and consumer mentality.

Chuck Crismier: In other words, this is one of the hardest places it is to get, to come to truly be a follower of Jesus Christ.

Lana Silk: It is harder in the US. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. It's hard in Iran because they'll kill you. It's hard here because you can slip into a spiritual coma, and you got to actively protect that kind of radical Christianity that Jesus has called us to.

Chuck Crismier: And here, if you say something like that on a basketball court, you're excoriated and become the focus of a national news media.

Lana Silk: That's right. So are you prepared to be canceled for Jesus?

Chuck Crismier: Okay. So how is it that people are coming to Christ when, for instance, this woman that I was telling you about, I have her long article here, she actually, when she became a Christian, was thrown into the even prison there, the worst prison in Iran.

Lana Silk: Um, you know, we are living in a spiritual drought, in real darkness in Iran today. My father often says, some of the greatest evangelists that Iran ever had were the Ayatollahs. My dad went to prison twice in the '60s and '70s because he was audacious enough to talk about Jesus on the street, when he was perfectly legal, but people didn't want to hear it. And my dad first talked about what a hard ground it was, that, you know, if like if 50 or 100 people came to know the Lord in a year, you'd say it was a year of harvest. Well, now millions of people are coming to know the Lord. So there has certainly been a great spiritual awakening because the darkness has been exposed. And that is a good thing in Iran. So there is, despite the danger, there is overwhelming appetite for truth, for life. You know, Iranian people are fighting right now for peace and freedom, and we know that the right, the only true lasting version of those things are found in Jesus, and they are starting to turn to Him in great numbers and finding what they're looking for in Him.

Chuck Crismier: All right. Now, you're here and you've been out of the country for a very long time now. How do you know that millions are coming to the Lord in Iran?

Lana Silk: Well, first of all, we have some statistical study that was done about six years ago by an organization in Holland, and at that point, their research led us to deduce that about 1.2 million Christians existed in Iran then. Now, let me give you context, Chuck, that's 2020. In 1979, there were maybe 500 Muslim background Christians in Iran. So we have had such an awakening even since then. And also, what, the, the general consensus is, if not the fastest, Iran is one of the fastest growing churches in the world. So if you pull all the kind of metrics that, that people are talking about, you're looking at three, four, five million Christians in Iran today. We only need to look at our own ministry, you know, we have tens of millions of views and visitors to our Christian sites, to our, the material that we put out. And you know, we think hundreds of thousands of people have been led to the Lord just through us directly, let alone indirectly.

Chuck Crismier: How do you disciple such people? How, how do you disciple such people when they're coming to the Lord, but now what?

Lana Silk: Yeah, great question. So we have a discipleship program, um, and people can call in and speak to a pastor who lives outside the country. And we have a year-long program. They they'll get called every week and they get discipled one-to-one. Uh and you know, what's really fun is it's quite normal for those calls, few months into the call, to have the person on the other end of the line in Iran say, I hope you don't mind. I've been telling other people what you've been telling me. Now I have 30 people in here and you're on speaker and everyone wants to know.

Chuck Crismier: So, so are these pastors that you're referring to, do they speak Farsi?

Lana Silk: Oh, yes. Yeah, our team is Farsi-speaking. We have non-Farsi-speaking brothers and sisters who help us, but our core team is Farsi-speaking.

Chuck Crismier: Okay. So, uh, so many are coming to the Lord, but they're not allowed to meet in what we call churches, are they?

Lana Silk: No, they're not. No. So,

Chuck Crismier: So how do they gather? How do they gather and support one another?

Lana Silk: Yeah, in their homes, in small groups. But you know, even then, they know people who are Christians. We have many people who are completely on their own, still praying for their families, isolated. So we provide a digital church network and people can call in to meetings through the network. We have live satellite broadcast services on Fridays and then on Sundays through Zoom, prayer meetings through the week. So really creating opportunities for people to connect.

Chuck Crismier: All right. So what if somebody there in Iran is connected to one of your Zoom teaching situations, and a neighbor who's a Muslim finds out about it? What what is expected?

Lana Silk: They would be at risk. Yeah, depending on the, um, strength of feeling in the neighbor, they could be turned into the authorities.

Chuck Crismier: So in other words, there's considerable risk for a person even to have a house church.

Lana Silk: Oh, absolutely there is. Yeah, and part of our discipleship program is to teach them matters of security. Just smart ways to gather that doesn't draw attention, thinking about the size of the group, the location, their regularity. Yeah. We also provide AI-based tools to help people who are particularly concerned for their safety. They can have discipleship support and all sorts of teaching and apologetics teaching through an AI platform, Kairos. And we have a lot of people now that use that in safety and anonymity in their homes. And we've had a lot of people turn to turn to Jesus because of it. We had a seeker in January in the protests, right in the middle where they were killing all the people, found Kairos for, I don't know, how he got hold of it. Well, we provide a free VPN and we advertise it on that. So perhaps that's how he found it.

Chuck Crismier: Well, it sounds to me like you're in this digital world, you understand it, and so you're able to use that in an effective way that perhaps a guy like me, who's probably double your age, would not be so adept to do.

Lana Silk: Yeah, absolutely. God has given us some wonderful engineers to help us pioneer programs and software that is helping us overcome some of these barriers.

Chuck Crismier: That's terrific. You know, what you did not know is that 32 years ago, we formed a house church in America. And I was a volunteer pastor, one of the fastest growing churches in Southern California at that time. Even while I was practicing law. And I came to the realization, I believed that things, the pressure was going to become greater and greater in our country, so that true followers of Jesus Christ would find it very difficult to truly survive in our mega churches because the government and other pressures would keep them from doing so, and they would, they would conform to the ways of the world, and eventually, when the testing became severe, they would succumb. What say you in response to that?

Lana Silk: Well, I think that is a challenge to all of us, to be honest. There every environment will, the enemy will use whatever environment we're in to seed lies in our mind. The Word of God tells us that He is the father of lies, and He will use lies to warp our understanding of the person of God, our inheritance in Him, how we stand in Him. You know, right from the beginning with Eve, that was His number one modus operandi, you know, did God really say, can this really be true? So I think in every context, yes, the, the enemy can use sort of being lost in the crowd of a celebrity pastors, mega church, he can use that, and he can use isolation in a lonely corner of Iran as well.

Chuck Crismier: Okay. Transform Iran. What really is it? How can we connect with it? Is there any way that our listeners, let's suppose that we have a listener who actually has Iranian bloodline, or came from Iran, or has a relative or somebody, how would they connect with you?

Lana Silk: Right. Well, if you have Iranian bloodline, I want to say to you, take heart. God sees our country. God has great plans to prosper our country and give it a hope and a future, and He is busy fighting and winning a battle that is not only going to glorify His name in Iran, but is going to spread the glory of God through the nations out of Iran. And I'm so excited for the world to see who God is and what He's capable of as they see what He has achieved in Iran. That will be my first encouragement.

Chuck Crismier: All right. We'll be right back after this.

Lana Silk: I haven't answered your question. Yeah, let's get to that.

Chuck Crismier: All right, we'll be right back after this so you can give them some details about how people can connect with that. Uh, this is we're talking with Lana Silk, friends. It's a fascinating conversation. I'm looking into her blessed and glorious face here, and what a privilege this is. We'll be right back.

Chuck Crismier: As we talk with Lana Silk here on the program today concerning the rapid growth of the underground church in Iran. Our hearts have to be encouraged and strengthened, but then also challenged because we realize that here in the United States of America, we just do not have hardly anything that resembles the strength and commitment of the Iranian people becoming Christians in a world where to have them discovered would likely result in execution.

Chuck Crismier: We just don't have that here. And so things, as she said, are too easy. Comfort has become the way of life. And so God wants to comfort the comfortless, but he wants to upset the comforters. Those that are comfortable.

Lana Silk: He does. He does. He never promised a comfy life following Him. I don't know how he turned it into this, come and everything will be just fine, because that's the opposite of what Jesus said.

Chuck Crismier: That's right. Well, it's kind of like the evangelist, the televangelist of yesteryear, back in the 1960s. I got a feeling everything's going to be all right. Such a giddy kind of gospel, just amazing. Hey, um, how do people then connect with your ministry? Here in the States, or wherever they're listening around the world, how do people connect with your ministry called Transform Iran?

Lana Silk: So you can go to our website, transformiran.com. You can spend time there. We have a ton of resources for you to learn about the situation in Iran, read testimonies, find out what we're doing. And then you can sign up for a newsletter to pray. We, we really invite you to come in on an adventurous journey with us to see God do impossible things in an impossible place. If you get our newsletters monthly, I can promise you, not only will you be excited to hear what God is doing in Iran, but you'll be excited for what God can do in your life when you see what He's doing in places as difficult as that. So, when you get, you get to pray with us, you get to pray informed, and then we invite you if God is stirring your heart to support the ministry. You can do that through the website. But if I had to choose between someone to come in and write me a check, or to commit to pray for me, I would choose the prayer. So come and pray for us and be part of this adventure with us.

Chuck Crismier: All right. Now, I'm going to ask you a very direct question. Is this a ministry or a business?

Lana Silk: Oh, it's a, what do you mean by business? Is that truly a ministry?

Chuck Crismier: That, that indeed is the problem. Is the question. Because an awful lot of so-called ministries out there are really at their roots, just businesses. And people use the term ministry in order to get money.

Lana Silk: Oh, no.

Chuck Crismier: So,

Lana Silk: Oh, no.

Chuck Crismier: It sounds to me like you are deeply committed to the Kingdom of God and to get this message out.

Lana Silk: Oh, Chuck, my heart is still back in Iran. I knew at nine years old when we came out that my call was in Iran, was Iran. I even continued to read my Bible in Farsi, knowing I had to keep my language alive because God had plans for me in my country.

Chuck Crismier: Good for you.

Lana Silk: So, I will continue that way. We are focused on an Open Iran. Just today, I had a meeting with some of our leaders talking about the plans that have to be in place because Iran is about to experience a massive shift and we, the church, need to be ready.

Chuck Crismier: Is your husband working with you in this mission?

Lana Silk: My husband is my first and best supporter. Um, he, he travels with me, he ministers to people with me. He is, he is with me 100%. Yes.

Chuck Crismier: All right. Do you go travel to speak in various places?

Lana Silk: I do. Yes. I speak at events and churches all over the country, well, in different countries too, but mostly in the US.

Chuck Crismier: All right. Well, you're very well spoken and I, I appreciate. I, I really went out of my way to, to connect with you, Lana. I really do.

Lana Silk: I appreciate that.

Chuck Crismier: And I wanted to make sure that we were able to do this because I sensed that you were the real deal. And we don't mess, we don't mess around on this program. It's serious. We deal with the serious issues concerning our lives as Christians around the world and here in the States, and, uh, I considered it a great privilege to be able to connect with you here. Now, you say that you are Armenian and also Persian. And it's interesting. Go ahead.

Lana Silk: Sorry. Well, I would say Armenian Iranian because Persian is probably more accurate for those who are sort of the, the 45% who consider themselves ethnically Persian in Iran. But Iran is 79 plus different people groups, 39 plus different languages.

Chuck Crismier: Well, I know, I know that Armenians, Iran was heavy with Armenians. I know that. And, and Armenians have been a very significant part in my life. Going back into, I came from Southern California and in that area, it's a huge Armenian community. And so much so that one Armenian man facilitated even while I was practicing law because I was speaking concerning the Kingdom of God throughout Southern California, and he facilitated my speaking in a variety of Armenian churches. And so I had to, I had to learn one word of Armenian, that is, I ain't no Odar. I'm no stranger.

Lana Silk: It's going to be in all Armenian. That's hilarious.

Chuck Crismier: So anyway, the Armenians I've always seen as very much like Gentile Jews, uh, very much similar to that. And of course, they're there in Iran. But the Armenians, Armenia was the first country to declare itself a Christian country. That was 321 AD.

Lana Silk: They're the first Christian country in the world. You know that.

Chuck Crismier: Well, yeah. So how does that fit when there's so many Armenians there in, in Persia or Iran?

Lana Silk: Well, in Iran, um, there are two ethnic groups that are considered Christian by ethnicity, by the government. Armenians and Assyrians. So there are Armenian churches, like Orthodox churches and Assyrian, and they're allowed to worship in their own language, as long as they do not allow any Persians into their meetings, as long as they don't use the Persian language, any kind of evangelism. Some of our most respected martyrs in the Iranian church have been Armenians who defied this rule and, and shared the gospel with Iranian Muslims and led them to the Lord. Um, so there, there are different kinds of Armenians in Iran. But those who have, um, decided that they want to minister to the Muslims and lead them to the Lord, are all in the underground church. They can't do that openly.

Chuck Crismier: All right. I want to, uh, read a paragraph that came from another source. Actually, this came from you. By Lana Silk, growing Iran's underground church under the Islamic regime's tyranny. Because I, I saw another guy's name above here and I forgot to see your name. Okay, here it is. Ultimately, it's rare for the Iranian church to find other believers due to the dangers Christians face. Rather, they create them, that is, create the opportunities. It's nothing short of miraculous. One individual may encounter Jesus in a dream or a vision, give his or her life to Christ and then lead their entire family or neighborhood to salvation. Likewise, we've heard stories of families reading the gospel message for the very first time in their native heart languages, while sitting around their living rooms and in those moments, everyone surrenders their life to Christ.

Chuck Crismier: What profound faith to learn of Jesus and understand the cost of persecution and give one's life fully to such a cause. Wow. That's quite a statement that you're making there, and it's, it's unreal as compared to what we see here in the United States. So what would you say to us to encourage us to be and become the kind of followers of Yeshua, of Jesus Christ, that these new believers are experiencing?

Lana Silk: I would say, get back to your, the Word of God, dive right in, allow God to awaken in you a passion for Him that is completely insatiable. Understand that pearl of great worth that was worth more than everything else. And then beyond that, start taking risks. You know, in a persecuted environment, any kind of active Christian life comes with risk. And when you take risks, then you have to be dependent on God. You can't do it on your own. You know, I, I don't need the Holy Spirit to tie my shoelaces or cross the street. But I do need the Holy Spirit if someone's got a gunpoint to my head and saying, denounce your faith. You know, you got to get yourself into a place where you're entirely dependent on God, and you're giving Him an opportunity to show His power in and through you. I have a sign in my closet. Every morning as I step out of my closet, it says, what does, what risk am I going to take today? What does risk look like today? And you know, that's, we have to remind ourselves in a free society because we sometimes have to create space for those kinds of risks.

Chuck Crismier: Well, the only way we understand risk in this country, uh, Lana, is in the financial world. That's the only way Americans understand risk, and they say, uh, no risk, no reward. The greater the risk, the greater the reward. But we don't understand that in the nature of our faith because it just doesn't compute.

Lana Silk: No, and yet that statement is just as true in the spiritual realm. The greater will lean on God and let Him be God, the greater the exciting adventure we'll get to have in Him.

Chuck Crismier: All right. So how do your kids respond to that message?

Lana Silk: My kids are phenomenal. I'm very proud of my kids. They have, we have done work very hard from, from as young as they, like they could speak, to teach them this kind of dependence on God. When the kids were very young, we started a house church in England, and one of the things that we would do is we would go to our town center, we would pair up, and we would start praying for the people around us and asking the Lord to give us His words for the people around us, and we would approach them and tell them that we were Christians, and we felt God was highlighting them to us and wants to share the gospel. And I remember my daughter from as young as five years old, prophesying over people on the street, giving them God's good news. You know, we, we worked hard to teach them to be bold and courageous and to allow God to shine through them and do things that they could not do in their own strength.

Chuck Crismier: Well, that's exactly what God told Joshua, be strong and courageous, do not tremble.

Lana Silk: That's right. Exactly. Yeah. Given him space to shine. Yeah.

Chuck Crismier: Well, Lana, I believe that God has given you a special, a special calling. Uh, I don't know whether it would be called a prophetic calling. I think it's sort of a mixture of an evangelistic call and a prophetic call because you are speaking almost more like a prophet than an evangelist because evangelists tend to muddy the waters and make try to make people feel good to sell the gospel. I don't think you're doing that. I think you're you're straight out representative.

Lana Silk: No, I don't. No.

Chuck Crismier: Well, that's very kind of you.

Lana Silk: I think the kind of evangelist that the Word of God invites us to be isn't that. We have some wonderful evangelists serving today who are fearless in how they represent God. But I agree, there's we have to be prepared to look foolish and let God look good.

Chuck Crismier: Right. Okay. Well, you talk about, uh, radical obedience, contagious hope, and a quiet revolution of love, transform, transforming Iran from the inside out. Did you know, Lana, that the word obey has become the most hated word of the church today in America?

Lana Silk: Oh, no, I didn't.

Chuck Crismier: How do you respond to that?

Lana Silk: Not entirely surprised. Not entirely surprised. Obedience requires the denying of yourself and denying of what you think you might be entitled to. I think entitlement is a big enemy in the US, and I've worked very hard to make sure it doesn't take root in my children. My poor kids, when they were very young, if they ever showed signs of entitlement, I would say, the only thing you're entitled to is eternal damnation.

Chuck Crismier: Well, that is true.

Lana Silk: Which is true.

Chuck Crismier: Hey, Lana, do us a favor here. We're right at the end of the program. Would you pray for us here in America?

Lana Silk: Yes, I will. I will. I have the listeners don't take that in the in the heart then rich it was intended. Because I wanted my kids to understand that everything is the mercy and goodness of God that's unmerited and undeserved. And we would do good to remember that. Yeah, I would love to pray.

Chuck Crismier: All right, do it.

Lana Silk: Lord, I thank you. Your word does tell us that you have good plans for us, plans to give us a hope and a future and not to harm us. And Lord, I, if anyone has stuck with us to this point, then I've no doubt that their heart is in the same place that ours is, that we are on our knees for our nation. Chuck said it so well right at the beginning, Transform America. You know, God is in the business of transformation. He wants to transform Iran, He wants to transform America, He wants to transform our lives. So we invite you, Lord, to transform us inside out, and give us the courage to follow you wherever you might lead us.

Chuck Crismier: In Jesus name we pray, amen. Giving you a holy hug over the airwaves here, Lana. You're a blessing, sister. We'll be in touch. Again, Transform Iran.com, correct? That's the one. Transform Iran.com. Go there, friends, check it out, pray for Lana, pray for those that are working with her and for the saints in Iran, that God by His Spirit will continue to strengthen and direct them and reveal himself to them, that the Kingdom of God may spread even where the Ayatollah is seeking to strangle it. God bless and be a blessing.