Focus on the Family

Host (John Fuller): Welcome to Focus on the Family's Weekend Broadcast. We hope the following program will challenge you and encourage you in your faith journey.

Guest (Female): Ugh. All right, nearly 2:00 a.m. You got this. You can finish any science project before it's due. Already tucked the kids into bed. Who is I supposed to call? No, I just need to finish this. Oh, and I've got the kids' lunches tomorrow. This house needs to be cleaned. Did I eat today? There's just so much to do, and I'm nowhere near done, and I just wish I could do more.

Host (John Fuller): Well, we all get caught up in the busyness of life, don't we? And you probably feel with some frequency like you're running on empty. Uh, today's Focus on the Family with Jim Daly is for you as we explore important rhythms that will help you have a more healthy, more meaningful life. Thanks for joining us. I'm John Fuller.

Host (Jim Daly): John, do you ever get caught in that, uh, exchange with somebody where they say, "How are you doing?" I'm so busy. You just go into this whole litany of 14 things you got to do.

Host (John Fuller): And then they respond like, "Oh, you're busy. Well, let me tell you how busy I am." Yes. Yeah, absolutely.

Host (Jim Daly): I'm guilty of that because, you know, usually I'm pretty busy. And, boy, you want to know about it, I'll tell you. You know, I'm flying here, I'm going there and, you know, we wear it like a badge of honor, but, uh, our guest today is going to challenge that and say, "Are you sure that's healthy?" And I, I think I'm at the point of saying amen. I don't think that's the way we should go, and the problem, of course, is that that lifestyle is unsustainable. I don't think it's what the Lord wanted for us when He talks about, uh, bringing life to the full and what does that mean? And we're going to explore that today.

Host (John Fuller): Yeah, and Deborah Fileta has been with us a number of times. She's always very popular as a guest. Uh, she's an author, speaker, a counselor and, uh, she writes and speaks about marriage and relationships, and today we'll hear about a book that really is so deep and rich, Jim. I don't know how much of it we'll be able to cover today and next time, but it's called Soul Care: Find Life-Giving Rhythms, Live Restored, Avoid Burnout and Discover Unspeakable Joy. And we've got details about Deborah and the book at focusonthefamily.com/weekend.

Host (Jim Daly): Deborah, welcome back to Focus. It's so good to have you.

Guest (Female): It's good to be back with you both.

Host (Jim Daly): It's so fun. Um, well, we kind of set it up there. Maybe you can bounce off of that. This idea of busyness and the badge of honor and I think the American culture, uh, really raises that to a high standard, don't we? Maybe too high. We kind of put it out there for people to see how busy we are so you can tell us how good we are.

Guest (Female): Yeah, I think we tend to value the amount of things that we have going on, um, rather than the quality of the things that we have going on. It's not about the quantity. It's about doing what God has called us to do. Um, and I think you're right when you said it's not sustainable. And that's the bottom line here. You know, as a licensed counselor, I see so many people coming into my office, high capacity, ministry, executive pastor, senior pastors, people who are burnt out.

Host (Jim Daly): Let's explore that a little bit, that burnout feeling. I'm not even sure, I think I have been there, but again, not being trained in that way to really understand it. I'm not sure that many of us as laypeople can know if we're on the edge of burnout. What are some of the descriptors for a person who's on the burnout glide path?

Guest (Female): Yeah. Well, let me start by asking a question. The first question I would ask is, "How full do you feel?" If zero is I feel totally depleted in life, and ten is I feel filled. What number would you give yourself? I think that's a really important question to ask. And then you want to start looking for symptoms of burnout, which are things like excessive fatigue, even after you've had a good night's rest. But I think one of the telltale symptoms is you start feeling apathy towards the things that you used to love doing. Um, honestly, it can also come with physical symptoms. As far as headaches and muscle aches and pains and all the different things that you don't know what to attribute it to, but it's causing you to feel depleted. And you want to be on the lookout for those kind of things.

Host (Jim Daly): Yeah, it's important because it's part of soul care, the title of your book. Let's talk about that. The title Soul Care. You know, we've got self-care and we got other things like that. So what is the differentiator with soul care? As Christians, we love that. Soul, we love the soul.

Guest (Female): Yeah, you're right. You're right. I think Christians tend to be, um, a little bit scared of the word self-care. Because of the focus on self. And, and here's the thing about it. The way that culture defines self-care is superficial. It's not enough to get a manicure, pedicure, take a warm bath if you're not getting to the roots of the things that are draining you, as well as the roots of the things that are going to fill you up. So even culture's definition of self-care isn't enough for us as Christians. We have to dig a little bit deeper, and soul care is birthed out of the six rhythms that Jesus Himself practiced to fill up during His time here on Earth. And if Jesus Himself understood that He had human capacity, and He had to honor that human capacity, though He was fully God, He was fully man. How much more do we have to have the humility to say, "I have a human capacity, and I need to honor that."

Host (Jim Daly): Yeah, and we're going to get to that because that's the core of the book, right? Before we get there though, Jesus said in Mark 12 about loving, you know, the Lord your God with all your heart, soul and mind. We understand that one. Loving your neighbor as yourself, we don't spend a lot of time thinking about that because on the one hand, we think loving ourselves is almost feels anti-Christian to do that. What do you see in the healthy clinical sense of what the Lord was expressing there? What do we do in a healthy way to love ourselves and then loving our neighbor?

Guest (Female): Well, I think the healthiest people are the ones who are the most filled up. You know, empty people have a hard time focusing on others. And I think sometimes we're so afraid to be selfish that we self-neglect.

Host (Jim Daly): And where that is a badge of honor.

Guest (Female): Yeah, exactly. And self-neglect leads us to self-sabotage because we're empty. And you know the irony in all that, when I self-neglect, when I neglect my needs, and I neglect what's going on inside of me, I feel so burnt out and empty that the only person I can think of is myself. You know when you're at your lowest point in life, you're not thinking of others. You're just thinking about how bad you feel and how empty you feel.

Host (Jim Daly): Well, it's almost like you can't think of others. That's your point.

Guest (Female): Exactly. It becomes this vortex of selfishness in a different way. But I think the balance of that is learning to honor and address our needs and how we can stay filled up so that we can continue to pour out in the way that God has called us. My dad used to always tell me growing up that human beings are like a well, and if you don't keep filling up your well, you're eventually going to run dry and you're not going to have anything to offer the people in need. And I, I see this as a message specifically for the caregivers out there, those of us, the counselors, the pastors, those in in healthcare, teachers, ministers, who are constantly pouring out. We have to be even more intentional about making sure that we're filled.

Host (Jim Daly): Yeah, that's so good. In fact, in the book, you had a story of a pastor, senior pastor, who did experience burnout. Describe, and of course, you've changed his name and I get all that to protect him. But describe his situation and what, what was the remedy?

Guest (Female): You know, he was at the height of ministry. He had this thriving church that was growing in a in an unexpected way, but he was on the verge of burnout. When he came into see me, he was done with ministry. He was feeling so bad emotionally and physically, so exhausted. And here's what it comes down to. Before you can start practicing healthy rhythms, you have to get to the root of why you don't practice them to begin with. If you don't get to the root of your underlying belief system, and why you tend to neglect yourself to begin with, you're just going to repeat the same patterns with time. So I had to sit with him and really start to dig, "Why do you neglect yourself? Why are you burnt out?" This man grew up in a family where his stepfather was so strict. He was such a perfectionist, and if you messed up, it was over for you. There was physical abuse, emotional abuse. So he learned to just put his needs on the back burner and focus on doing the right thing, in the right way, for his father and not rocking the boat in any way.

Host (Jim Daly): To avoid punishment.

Guest (Female): To avoid punishment. So here he was years later, doing the same thing in ministry, seeing what everybody else needed, trying to be perfect, not rocking the boat, not focused on his needs until he got to a place of complete depletion.

Host (Jim Daly): Yeah, that's so amazing. You know, Deborah, sometimes these things are so subtle. It, it doesn't sound subtle when you unfold it for your client. But then it just hits you. How do we understand how the subtleties of our childhood and the things we experience end up becoming this huge weight in our lives? How do we even start to think about the behaviors that we're acting out and where where they're connected?

Guest (Female): Yeah. Well, the first question to ask yourself is, "What's the belief system here? Why am I doing more than I should? Why do I always say yes? Why do I take more on my plate?" And we might find that underneath the surface, there's a belief system that thinks, "If I don't do it, nobody else will." Or, "I have to be the one to do this so that I have value in my life. I want to feel valued. I want to feel affirmed." There's a belief system that we carry, and oftentimes it's rooted in our trauma rather than in God's truth, who says that we are already loved, we are already valuable, we are already enough because of Jesus. And when we function out of the belief system of trauma, we find ourselves engaging in unhealthy patterns.

Host (Jim Daly): Wow. I mean, that that's something for us to take inventory of, you know, in our lives. What motivates us, why are we behaving the way we are? Right. Especially for those of us that are Christian because we should be the healthiest people on the face of this earth.

Guest (Female): I know.

Host (Jim Daly): Emotionally.

Guest (Female): Can you imagine?

Host (Jim Daly): And often we're not.

Guest (Female): I know. Can you imagine if the church took on the call to get healthy? How that could overflow into our world.

Host (Jim Daly): Yeah, that is so good. All right, you opened that door on the six principles that you've learned that Jesus demonstrated for us, and we'll get through all of them. Uh, let's start with nourish. Uh, what does it mean to be nourished?

Guest (Female): That was a unique place to start for me because I think the world helps us focus on our physical well-being, probably to a fault. But in church, we often neglect our physical well-being. But how can we go to Judea and Samaria and the ends of the earth when we're sick and tired and depleted, right? Our physical health, our temple, is such an important part of having healthy rhythms. And Jesus Himself stopped to take care of His body. The Bible says He was wearied with His journey, and so He would stop. It talks about Him making time to eat and drink and making sure His disciples were nourishing their bodies. Coming from a Middle Eastern family and thinking of Jesus saying to the disciples, "Come and eat," was a really refreshing look at Him because He actually cared about the state of their body because He knew that that was the path and the avenue to being able to do everything that God had called them to do.

Host (John Fuller): This Focus on the Family broadcast will continue in just a moment.

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Host (John Fuller): This is John Fuller, and Father's Day is a time to honor those men who lead their families with courage. On the new seasonal podcast from Focus on the Family, Legacy of Courage, we uplift dads with real stories, sharing humor, tender moments, and lessons that'll stay with you. Hearing from first-time dads to adoptive dads to seasoned pros, you'll be reminded about the power of a father rooted in God's strength and why showing up matters. You'll find it at celebratingfathers.com.

Host (John Fuller): Thanks for listening to Focus on the Family. Let's resume now with the balance of today's programming.

Host (Jim Daly): Deborah, you mentioned, uh, your, your heritage, Egyptian, and I remember going to, uh, someone's home, Peter, uh, who grew up in Lebanon. And, oh my goodness. I mean, coming over for, you know, in the States we'd say, "Hey, you want to come over for dinner?" They spent four days getting ready to do this meal for us.

Guest (Female): I believe it.

Host (Jim Daly): And the homemade hummus and the breads and the, you know, dates and the kitchen was fully decked out. Every counter had heaps of food. I'm going, "Peter, my goodness, you could feed 100 people." "This is what we do. We want to make sure you have enough."

Guest (Female): We want to make sure you're nourished.

Host (Jim Daly): I'm like, "Enough." I mean, but it was amazing. And I, I think for those of us that do the drive-through mostly, whatever that might be, you know, pick up the already cooked chicken and at Costco and get it to the table. Describe for us that culture of a meal. I mean, it's different. We don't, we don't possess that understanding of what it means to sit and eat together, the way the Lord did with His disciples. It's a gathering, it's something special.

Guest (Female): Well, first of all, it was a life-giving meal because of the people that were there, but also because of the types of foods that were being eaten. I mean, we've really strayed from that in modern America, 2024. The things that we're eating today are mostly processed and unhealthy rather than whole foods that nourish us. They might be foods that fill us, but they're not foods that nourish us. And, you know, interestingly enough, we work against God when we're not taking care of our bodies, whether it be not eating good foods, whether it be not drinking enough water. I had an experience where I was out on a ministry trip and I was dehydrated, and I started having heart palpitations and, you know, right away you're like, "This is spiritual warfare." It might not be a demon. It might be that you're just dehydrated. You know, sometimes we our our blood sugar is low. We're not eating healthy foods, and then we blame the enemy for it rather than seeing our role in the process of having a healthy body.

Host (Jim Daly): Well, I want to shout out to your husband, who's a doctor. You called him, right? "Honey, you need to pray for me. It's spiritual warfare." He said, "How much water have you had?"

Guest (Female): Exactly. "What's going on? How much water have you had?"

Host (Jim Daly): I love that. Start with the basics.

Guest (Female): Start with the basics. And and how often do we neglect the basics in the caring of our souls?

Host (Jim Daly): Yeah. The next one is rest. This is probably one of the more difficult ones going back to our initial conversation about being busy as a badge of honor to really be able to rest. And, you know, we think of Jesus as on 24/7. That's not really what happened.

Guest (Female): No, I think we give ourselves the impression that He was busy and always going and always pouring out. But when you look at scripture, and in the most beautiful part of writing this book was looking at Jesus through the lens of soul care. He was so good at it. And things that you notice that you would have never noticed before, had you not been looking for those things, um, Jesus was really good at pulling away and taking breaks. Um, He was really good at responding to His body's exhaustion. I'm tired. I'm wearied with my journey. What am I going to do? I'm not going to push through. I'm going to rest. I'm going to honor my capacity. My favorite verse was when Jesus took a nap. He climbed on the boat after a long day of ministry, and instead of just pushing through and doing more, you'd think He'd tell Himself, "I only have three years. I got to push through."

Host (Jim Daly): I'm not going to sleep.

Guest (Female): Yeah, I'm not going to sleep. He went on the boat, climbed down into the hull and took a nap.

Host (John Fuller): Now there's an element of trusting God in that. I mean, Jesus modeled that for us, but it's really hard to consider rest as somehow related to trusting God and acting in faith. How how do I do that when I stop?

Guest (Female): I was working with a client recently who said, "I feel guilty when I stop to rest and take naps." So we really had to dig, "What is the underlying belief system that's causing you to feel guilty?" And she said, "I don't feel valued when I'm not doing something. I feel like I have to be the one to do, do, do, do." And I challenged her, "Isn't there a sliver of pride in that, thinking that it's on us to do, rather than when I close my eyes and rest, I serve a God who is bigger than me, and He's able to take the little that I can give Him and multiply it. It's actually on Him, not on me." And I think sometimes when we have a hard time resting, there's a little bit of pride underneath that rather than trusting the Lord.

Host (Jim Daly): You know, so often, Deborah, and I've seen this personally. A friend of mine who he had never shared this before, but as a seven-year-old boy, he was molested by a neighbor. And, you know, as an adult, he was type A, high achiever, and it was so courageous of him because at one point he told me, he goes, "You're the first human being I've ever said this to. But I think I wake up every day trying to feel clean. And the only way I feel like I can get clean is if I work harder."

Guest (Female): Trying to prove himself.

Host (Jim Daly): Isn't that interesting? And it gets back to the point we made earlier, these connections that happen to us, and then how it translates into our actions. Many years later, perhaps, this struggle to feel clean and have to get rid of what was ugly, and to work my way through that. I mean, what a tumultuous, torturous

Guest (Female): I know.

Host (Jim Daly): Place to be in.

Guest (Female): It's funny because sometimes we look at the success or the good behavior as a positive thing. But if it's not rooted in healthy beliefs, it'll always lead us down an unhealthy path, which ends up in burnout, which ends up in us being in a place where our light is no longer shining.

Host (Jim Daly): Yeah. When it comes this idea of rest, I feel pretty good about this, honestly. And I, you know, I'm trying to be objective with my self-assessment. But you mentioned in the book, you know, try to live your life at 85%.

Guest (Female): Doesn't sound like something an Olympic coach would tell you, right?

Host (Jim Daly): I, I like that. I, I feel like that's what I try to do. And I think it's healthy. You leave some capacity.

Guest (Female): I'm glad to hear that.

Host (Jim Daly): And I don't always do it perfectly.

Guest (Female): Right.

Host (Jim Daly): But the point is, I think generally, I actually strive to do that.

Guest (Female): Well, if you think of our emotional energy like a budget, we all know that living at 100% max of your budget is unhealthy. I wouldn't tell you, "Spend every penny of your paycheck," because what happens when unexpected needs arise? You can't save for the future when you're living at max capacity. Our emotional energy is very similar, and we have to honor that and make sure we have margin. One thing that was really neat when I was, um, processing and writing soul care, I often tell my clients the 85% concept. When I thought about the concept of the Sabbath, there's one day of rest out of seven. When you calculate that out in percentage, guess what it comes out to?

Host (Jim Daly): It'd be about 15 to 18%.

Guest (Female): 85%.

Host (Jim Daly): Okay, the opposite. That other, yeah.

Guest (Female): The opposite. Uh, 15 to 18% rest, 85% work. So it's that concept that I think there's something really spiritual underneath the surface because God understands the way our bodies work and what our bodies need.

Host (Jim Daly): Oh, I think it's so perfect. Uh, you experienced a season in your life where you battled with insomnia. I think that's called growing older.

Guest (Female): I sure hope so.

Host (Jim Daly): I sure hope so. Man, I mean, so many of us over that, maybe 40 line, you start sleeping a little more restlessly. It's like, for my pattern, it's real good sleep at the beginning. And then 3:00 in the morning, I kind of get a little more restless. Start thinking about some things I need to do. And, uh, that can, I can struggle with that. But speak to that moment in your own life with insomnia and what that signal was for you.

Guest (Female): Well, one of the things that I challenge people to take seriously in soul care is the rhythms of sleep that they have. I think we get into a pattern of, "Well, nobody sleeps well, and this is just part of life." But we don't realize when we're not sleeping well, we're not functioning well either. Our judgment is depleted when we're tired. Our response is slower when we're tired. So for me, understanding that insomnia was a signal, like, "What's going on here? Is are my chemicals off? Is this hormonal? Is this anxiety? Is there something that I need to adjust underneath the surface?" Rather than just ignoring it, pushing through, covering it up, actually figuring out what is this telling my body and what do I need to do differently to respond.

Host (Jim Daly): You know, you're seeing people that have come to that conclusion in in your practice as a counselor. What percentage of people broadly do you think are in that spot where they're going, "Okay, this might require some help." I know that's not a scientific question because it's hard to guess, but I, I would think it'd be on the smaller end.

Guest (Female): I think it's on the smaller end.

Host (Jim Daly): 10 to 15% that are going, "Okay, I need to do something."

Guest (Female): I think the more likely response is to push through. And that's the unfortunate thing.

Host (Jim Daly): Yeah. And just pile it on and then 20 years later, you have a real massive problem.

Guest (Female): I would say maybe even two years later. Yeah, absolutely.

Host (Jim Daly): Okay. So, so I'm thinking of somebody as you raised that good question, Jim. I'm thinking, Deborah, of somebody that I know. He's late 20s, and he goes to sleep around 11:00 at night and gets up at 2:00 or 3:00 in the morning. That's it. He sleeps three or four hours a night.

Guest (Female): Wow.

Host (Jim Daly): And and I thought that's a little unusual. And he seems to have accepted that. He, he goes running at 3:00 in the morning just to deal with that. So what do you what would your guess be in terms of how I can help him see, "Maybe this isn't normal."

Guest (Female): It is unusual. Yeah. Well, I, I would challenge him that this is a signal of something going on underneath the surface. Um, because we are supposed to have healthy rhythms of sleep. We were made for healthy rhythms of sleep. We were created the circadian rhythm of day and night. And so rather than just think this is how I am, we need to start investigating and figure out first step, seeing a doctor. Second step, seeing a counselor. And trying to get to the root of what some of this might be, whether it's physical or whether it's psychological and emotional and something that needs to be addressed.

Host (Jim Daly): Yeah, this kind of goes back to your first, one of your first observations, "Why am I this way? Why am I letting this happen?"

Guest (Female): Right.

Host (John Fuller): Right.

Host (Jim Daly): Yeah, and it could be first step might be pray and, uh, ask the Lord to reveal to you what's happening there. And I think that's a good place to end, Deborah. Um, Jesus's modeling. We're going to come back next time and explore some of the other attributes that you've highlighted. But ending, I think, on the, the high note of God's creation, what He wants from us and what He modeled for us. Jesus did model emotional health and well-being. What are those snippets that you could close here at the end and encourage people to think about as they, uh, live their day-to-day life and want to honor God and how they do that?

Guest (Female): Yeah. I would say the best way that we can continue to pour out in the way that God has called us to, in the most effective way, is to make sure that we remain filled because our level of effectiveness is directly correlated to our level of fullness.

Host (John Fuller): Such great insights today from our guest, Deborah Fileta, as she talked about her book Soul Care: Find Life-Giving Rhythms, Live Restored, Avoid Burnout, and Discover Unspeakable Joy. Uh, those are some challenging benchmarks, Jim, for all of us, living a restored life and avoiding burnout, experiencing unspeakable joy.

Host (Jim Daly): I'm thinking, where do you sign up? And there may be someone listening right now who says, "That sounds impossible." And it is without the power of God working in our lives. I love Deborah's advice, to live like Jesus and follow His example. Sounds pretty simple. Uh, we won't do it perfectly, of course, but that's why we need His truth and love and grace and forgiveness each and every day. Soul care is an excellent resource that can help you grow in your faith. That's the point. Get a copy today, make a monthly pledge of any amount to the ministry, and we'll put this book in your hands or send a one-time gift, whatever you can afford.

Host (John Fuller): Yeah, and another resource we have for you is our counseling team. And if you or a member of your family, uh, need to talk with someone about an issue that you're facing, we'll be happy to set up a free phone consultation for you. Call us, 800, the letter A, and the word family, 800-232-6459, or donate and get Deborah's book, and, uh, connect with a counselor at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.

Host (Jim Daly): John, let me remind everyone why giving to this ministry, uh, is so critical. Your financial support is the fuel, I often mention that, that we need for everything we do. Programs like this one, our counseling team, resources like Deborah's book and so much more. And here's the thing. Uh, Nielsen ratings, we buy that book, so we know how many people generally are listening to us. And when we look against that large audience, thank you, Lord, that so many people, literally millions are listening. But only about 1% of the people who listen actually support the ministry financially through the broadcast and podcast. So we really need to see if we can just move that up one notch, 2% of folks might give. And even $10 a month will make a huge difference from a number of people. So if you can, $10 a month. Can you build into people's lives that way?

Host (John Fuller): Yeah, donate today and become a friend of the family. Uh, we'd love to hear from you. Our number's 800-A-FAMILY, or, uh, visit focusonthefamily.com/weekend. And thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. I'm John Fuller, inviting you back as we continue the conversation with Deborah Fileta and, once again, help you and your family thrive in Christ.

Host (John Fuller): You're listening to Focus on the Family's Weekend Broadcast. We'll take a quick break and then return with the second half of this program for your family. Stay tuned.

Guest (Female): Is your marriage struggling, communication breaking down, trust fading, conflict that never seems to resolve? Well, there's still hope. Hope Restored Marriage Intensives by Focus on the Family helps couples step away from daily life and focus fully on rebuilding their relationship. And right now through the Marriage Investment Initiative, Hope Restored is investing $1,000 toward marriage intensives. Visit hoperestored.com/invest.

Host (John Fuller): Soul Care is birthed out of the six rhythms that Jesus Himself practiced to fill up during His time here on Earth. And if Jesus Himself understood that He had human capacity, and He had to honor that human capacity, though He was fully God, He was fully man. How much more do we have to have the humility to say, "I have a human capacity, and I need to honor that."

Host (Jim Daly): Wow. Uh, that is an important reminder for us today. Uh, this is Focus on the Family with Jim Daly, and we're so glad that Deborah Fileta is back with us to continue the conversation, offering thoughts like you just heard. We're looking forward to hearing more from her about self-care and, uh, how to do that well as a believer. Your host is Focus President and author, Jim Daly, and I'm John Fuller.

Host (Jim Daly): John, last time Deborah began describing some life-giving habits that we as Christians, particularly, should engage, and they're outlined from Scripture. I was really enthralled with it. I mean, thinking about how Jesus modeled the things that we should be doing, including nourishing our bodies, making sure we get the right amount of sleep, filling our own well so we could fill the well of others, right? That is a deeply spiritual message. And I'm looking forward to getting back to today, and we're going to cover the next three out of her great book, Soul Care.

Host (John Fuller): It's a terrific resource, and the full title of the book is Soul Care: Find Life-Giving Rhythms, Live Restored, Avoid Burnout, and Discover Unspeakable Joy. It's a terrific resource. Call us for details, 800, the letter A, and the word family, or stop by focusonthefamily.com/weekend.

Host (Jim Daly): And we started this conversation last time. So if you missed it, uh, get a hold of us. We can get an audio copy to you, or you go to the website, download it that way, or the, uh, app.

Host (John Fuller): The mobile app is terrific.

Host (Jim Daly): Which is what I do. So, uh, that's what I typically listen, is, uh, through the app. Uh, Deborah, welcome back. Good to have you here.

Guest (Female): Good to be back as always.

Host (Jim Daly): All right, uh, we talked about some of the rhythms last time. You identified six rhythms or lifestyle choices in your book, um, and how Jesus modeled these for us. Quickly, uh, what are the six rhythms and we'll jump into number what I think will be four.

Guest (Female): Number three.

Host (Jim Daly): Or number three.

Guest (Female): Yeah. The first is nourish. Nourish our bodies and how we can honor our bodies with a proper nutrition, hydration, and movement, just like Jesus did, taking care of our temples. The second one is about rest, and making sure that we, um, trust God when we lay down and sleep and realize that we can only do what we can do and our body needs to be energized by rest and how important that is in being a healthy person. Um, the third one is protect, and it talks about setting healthy boundaries, like Jesus did. Sometimes we think of Jesus as someone who always said yes, but that's not actually the case. The fourth one is connect, to make sure that we are engaging in life-giving relationships. The fifth one, which I'm excited to talk about, is savor, and it's about enjoying life and being present in it. And then the sixth one is tune in. Be aware of what's going on underneath the surface of your life emotionally.

Host (Jim Daly): You know, I'm going to go back to something from last time because you sparked a thought for me when it comes to rest. The level of anxiety and depression in the country right now, especially North America, all of us, uh, is so high, particularly in young people. The idea that we need to be okay with what happened today and trust God is so critical.

Guest (Female): You're right.

Host (Jim Daly): I mean, to trust God to say, "Okay, Lord, I'm going to lay my head on the pillow tonight, and whatever is is, and I believe in you, I trust in you fully." That should give you a good night's sleep.

Guest (Female): Yeah. I think the higher our level of trust, the easier it is for us to rest. And if that's not the case, like we talked about earlier, struggling with insomnia, that means there must be something going on underneath the surface that I need to identify and deal with.

Host (Jim Daly): Let's move to protect, which is that next one. Uh, you did some research for the book that, uh, caught you by surprise, how people viewed boundaries as a bad thing.

Guest (Female): Yeah.

Host (Jim Daly): Because you know, there is no literature psychologically. I'm thinking of the book Boundaries by our good friends. Right. Um, boundaries are a good thing. Why do we say or think they're bad things?

Guest (Female): I think we have an unhealthy definition, a wrong definition of boundaries. We just assume that boundaries just mean saying no to people in need. And we assume that Jesus didn't have boundaries because He always said yes, and good Christians should always say yes. We shouldn't say no. But that's not actually the case, first and foremost, and that's not how Jesus lived. When I look through the gospel, through the lens of soul care, I was shocked at how frequently Jesus said things like, "No," and, "Not yet." "It's not my time." "No, I'm not going to do it this way. I'm actually going to do it this way." "No, I'm not going to go to that town. I'm going to go to the next town." He wasn't under the obligation of man. His number one priority was to do what God had called Him to do. And when I think of boundaries, I think of the word protect because it's the way that we protect our calling, what God has called us to do. So it's a really important part of being healthy.

Host (Jim Daly): Let me make sure we have this in a practical way. Um, I can remember Jean when she was at UC Davis, she was doing a chemistry degree pre-vet and, you know, had a load that she was carrying, and she was going to a church there and the pastor had asked her if she she could run the children's ministry. And when she looks back on it, she felt like she couldn't say no. And she was young, and she said, you know, "Today, I could." But I took on so much, and it almost destroyed, you know, her ability to do well in school, which was the main thing. And I, I guess the question there in that example is how do we develop that backbone to be able to say no? Because it feels contrary to a Christian attitude of kindness and always being available for people. We give that a the letter grade of an A. If you're acting that way, you're an A Christian. And if you turn people down, you're actually a C Christian. Speak to that need to say no.

Guest (Female): Yeah. I think it's important to address the underlying belief system that we talked about in the last conversation, "Why do you feel like you can't say no? What is the underlying belief system there?" Maybe I feel like it's wrong. Maybe I believe that it's my job to fix the problem, um, and that if I don't do it, nobody else will. Because that underlying belief system will keep you saying yes to so many things till your plate gets so heavy that it breaks. We have to realize that every time we say yes to something, we are automatically saying no to something else because we have human capacity. So it's not just about saying yes to everything and everyone. It's about prayerfully considering what God and God alone wants us to say yes to.

Host (Jim Daly): Let me ask you this question. When, when you place that boundary around your heart, uh, it's a positive. I think so many of us, and I, I put myself right there with Jean. I'm not pointing that out. I think we all learn over time to not simply be people-pleasers, but to put those boundaries. I think it comes with maturity and sanity. But speak to that idea of protecting your own heart so that you have more for other people.

Guest (Female): Right. I have to sneak this quote in from a friend of mine who's a counselor. She said, "Behind every people-pleaser was usually once a parent-pleaser." Where we grew up in a situation where we had to just constantly make sure our parents were okay because there was addictions, there was chaos, there was unhealthy expectations put on us. And you kind of start living out of that cycle of pleasing people, saying yes to more and more. What happens though is you run out of energy. I, I worked with a a woman in counseling just recently who said yes to everything and everyone at work, but then when she walked through the doors of her home, she was so depleted that she had nothing left to give to her husband and children, and she was feeling bad about it like, "I want to give them more, but I can't." And the reality is, she had to start prioritizing and realize that all the things she said yes to were her saying no to her family in different ways because we have limited human capacity. No one of us is a superhero that can go above and beyond. Jesus Himself, who was fully God, yet fully man, honored His human capacity and said no so that He could reserve His energy for what God had called Him to do.

Host (Jim Daly): I think that's hard for many of us as believers to even comprehend that the Lord, He knew there were sick people in the next town over or what have you. But He couldn't do it all. I mean, I guess that's the conflict. He could have but chose to protect that time and to make decisions that He needed to make for His own soul care. I mean, it's weird to talk about God and His own soul care.

Guest (Female): I know.

Host (Jim Daly): It feels uncomfortable actually. But He did say no.

Guest (Female): He did say no.

Host (Jim Daly): And He did pass by people. And I, you know, it's hard to even imagine, "Why would God do that?"

Guest (Female): He did pass by people. He was limited by choice in His human body and His human capacity. And I think He wanted to model to us what it looks like to live fully as human beings. He was fully God, yet fully man, and and He modeled for us so well what it looks like to care for our souls and stay filled up.

Host (Jim Daly): Um, moving to the next rhythm, uh, being connected. That can mean a lot of things. How do you define being connected biblically? What does that look like?

Guest (Female): Being intentional with life-giving relationships. One of the most exciting things about studying the gospels as I was writing soul care was watching Jesus be a really good friend. You know, before He chose the disciples, the friends that He would say yes to. Think of all the people that wanted to rub elbows with Jesus, right? But He decided to focus in on the 12. And before He chose the 12, He spent the night in prayer. How often do we pray about our friends and the type of people that we should bring in close to our lives, the type of people that God wants us to invest in. Um, but Jesus was a really good friend. He was intentional with His friendships. He was intentional about giving and also receiving. Remember in the garden when He said to His disciples, "Here's what I need you to do for me. Stay awake and pray." Not only did He give to His friends, but He also allowed Himself to receive from His friends. So we can learn a lot from Jesus and how He engaged in life-giving relationships.

Host (Jim Daly): You know, you mentioned in Soul Care, Genesis 2:18, where God says, "It's not good for man to be alone," and creates woman. I've never really stepped back to think about the tenderness of that. And it's such a more beautiful, poetic way to think of God's heart for us.

Guest (Female): I know.

Host (Jim Daly): That He saw that, and He remedied that.

Guest (Female): He sees our needs, sometimes before we see them.

Host (Jim Daly): Ah, yeah.

Guest (Female): And He offers us ways, healthy ways to fill those needs. I think the next step is for us to be able to see our needs and then have the humility to receive what He's offered us to meet those needs in healthy ways.

Host (Jim Daly): You know, so often today we think of independence, especially again in North America, you know, we are heritage, we forge through the forest and we'd, you know, manifest destiny and all those things. And it's kind of ingrained in the culture. Um, but that pioneering spirit and the loneliness of it, being out there at the edge of the spear, you might say, isn't a great place for a human being because God created us for relationship. And in your research, you found some evidence that being alone is not a healthy place to be.

Guest (Female): It was almost scary to look at some of the research that showed that feeling lonely on a regular basis was almost as dangerous to your health as smoking a pack of cigarettes a day because, ultimately, the high levels of cortisol, the stress, lead to different types of disease. And so it was really fascinating to realize the effect that loneliness has on our physical body. And I think it goes back to the fact that God sees our needs. He knows it is not good for man to be alone. He knows that two are better than one. But I think it's easy for us, especially when we've been hurt, to push people away, to put up a wall and armor up instead of softening our hearts and realizing that how we protect ourselves is with boundaries, not with a wall to keep ourselves safe. Um, so I ask you to really consider, who are those life-giving relationships in your life? And if you don't have them, prayerfully consider what it might look like to invite some people into your inner circle so that you can engage in life-giving relationships because God knows you need them, and they're healthy for your soul.

Host (John Fuller): This Focus on the Family broadcast will continue in just a moment.

Guest (Male): Well, hi, I'm Dr. Danny Woerter, and when a teen is struggling with anxiety, the stress often brings sleepless nights and being pulled apart as parents. But many couples have walked this road and found deeper unity along the way. On Fearless Faith, I share common places where anxiety begins while young adults like Caroline share how they've grown with faith, patience, and community support. You also hear practical ways to care for your teen while strengthening your marriage. Listen at navigatingteenanxiety.com.

Host (John Fuller): Thanks for listening to Focus on the Family. Let's resume now with the balance of today's programming.

Host (Jim Daly): Deborah, you describe your mom as a servant-hearted person. I think we all know people like that. Maybe we perceive ourselves to be that kind of person, servant-hearted. But you admitted that you weren't kind of wired that way, and you had to learn to do that. One, describe that affirmation of maybe having a deficit and then overcoming it. Uh, how did you process that, seeing your mom, maybe wanting to be more like your mom, or what was it?

Guest (Female): Yeah. Yeah, it is interesting. I've kind of concluded that when you grow up being served to that level, I have a Middle Eastern mom. She loves to serve. You kind of get used to being served, and then when you're asked to serve others, I'm like, "I don't have that muscle quite yet because it's it's atrophied over the years." But I've realized that in maintaining relationships, healthy relationships, you have to give and receive. And so for me, I love to give in the ways of emotional connection, helping people emotionally through advice, through counsel, through prayer. But sometimes there's a physical need. "Hey, can you drive me to the airport?" And as much as I don't love to do those things, I have realized that you have to meet your friends where they're at, and you have to meet them with their needs. Whether or not it's something that you're good at, gifted at, or something you want to do, life-giving relationships require a level of sacrifice.

Host (Jim Daly): It's a good way to start.

Host (Jim Daly): You know, Deborah, this is a delicate question, and I'm not sure you covered it in the book, but I'm feeling it, observing women particularly, and some of the challenge 30, 40-something women are having today to try to be everything. I mean, you're a psychologist, your husband's a doctor, you have beautiful kids, you're doing, it seems like you're doing it all. And I, I, I have a heart for women who are trying to be kind of the traditional wife and mother, yet in an era where professional development is so valued. Right. Um, how does a healthy Christian woman balance all these things, not lean into worldly feminism and be the person that God needs her to be or wants her to be?

Guest (Female): I love that you ask that question because that's something that I'm passionate about and have had to learn along the way. And I think it starts with tweaking the belief system that you have to do it all because that is not a reality. Number one. You cannot do it all. Number two. You can only do what God has called you to do. And, you know, even looking at my life from the outside in, you would think, "Oh, she does all this, and kids and life and homeschool and travel." But I have set up so many boundaries because I know my human capacity. I know my limits. And what's been amazing is as I have pulled back from different things, as I have said, "I can't do this. I can only do this much. I am unable to do this." I have watched God take the small loaves and fish that I have and multiply it in ways that I could have never on my own. And it builds your faith because you know when you focus on the things that He's called you to do, and you focus on staying healthy and honoring Him in that way, He's like, "I got the rest. I will take care of the rest. Um, you just do what I've called you to do and don't believe the lie that you have to do it all." And so, you know, I feel like I'm living proof that God takes the little that you have and He multiplies it.

Host (Jim Daly): Uh, so that servant-hearted, connected attitude, let's move to the next one, this tuning into your inner world. What describe what that means?

Guest (Female): There's so much of life that's happening underneath the surface. You know, human beings are like a volcano, and we have all of this pressure building underneath the surface of our life. All of this stress, these expectations, these feelings. And our tendency is to ignore them and shove them away and just keep living our life. But when we do that, this pressure, just like a volcano, has to find the point of least resistance, and it will come out if we don't deal with it. And usually it comes out in an unhealthy way because the point of least resistance is usually something like rage, anger, relationship conflict, addictions, depression, anxiety. In soul care, I talk a lot about how Jesus had so many different feelings, that He addressed in scripture. He not only felt the feelings, He responded to them. So it's not that feelings are bad or good, healthy or unhealthy as we sometimes think. All feelings are a signal, and we're responsible for recognizing them and responding in healthy ways.

Host (Jim Daly): You this sounds a little more complicated perhaps than the others, and that's why we need to spend a few minutes on this. You had an example in soul care about a man who believed he was a burden to others. I feel like that is really attributable to a lot of women too. Um, that, you know, they don't want to be a burden so they don't talk about what they're really going through. We all do that. It doesn't matter what gender we are. Uh, describe that story and how is that belief impacting his life and how do we apply that to our own lives and identify, whoops, we might be in that same spot.

Guest (Female): Yeah. Sometimes we think that sharing our feelings with others is going to weigh them down, rather than realizing, this is a point of intimacy. When you connect with people on that level, you're inviting them into your life in a unique way. You're inviting them into an intimate relationship rather than a superficial one. And so, but here's what it starts with. It starts with us being aware of our own emotions. I think step two is finding people to share what's going on inside of us, people that are going to help us. But we can't do that if we're not aware of what we're feeling to begin with. I can't tell you how many people in the counseling office come in and I say, "Okay, let's talk about what are some feelings that are coming up in that situation." And so many people will right away say, "I don't know," because they haven't had the time, the effort, the language. They might not even have the language to begin really thinking through that. And to know that Jesus Himself felt all of these different feelings, and He stopped to recognize the feeling and then express it and do something about it.

Host (Jim Daly): And it's so good. And it it takes effort. It seems that's the battle in life. It's in our marriages. It's in our parenting. Just give these things some thought, especially through a scriptural lens. If we can do that, I think the answers from the Lord are very plain to see. It's just our ability to see them.

Guest (Female): Proverbs 24 verse 5 tells us that the the purposes of a person's heart, what's going on underneath the surface of our life, are like deep waters. But a person of insight draws them out. It takes work to draw out the waters underneath the surface of your life. But a person of insight, they can see what's going on inside. And it takes practice. It takes work. It's like a muscle. We have to develop it. Otherwise, when you don't use it, you lose it.

Host (Jim Daly): Right. I know that. Let's go to the last one in our last few minutes here, savor.

Guest (Female): That's my favorite one.

Host (Jim Daly): I'm going to say, yeah, that sounds good. It sounds tasty.

Guest (Female): I know.

Host (Jim Daly): Savor. What does that mean in the context of soul care?

Guest (Female): Savor life. Be present in this life that God has given us. We're often so distracted by what's coming up ahead or so burdened by what's happened in the past, that we don't take the time to really appreciate and be present in the moment that God has given us. This moment is a gift. And Jesus practiced savoring. You know, one of my favorite verses as I was writing soul care was in Matthew 13, and it says Jesus left the house and went and sat by the lake. And I, and I've never seen that verse before. But to think that Jesus just wanted to to sit by the lake, to enjoy the moment, to connect with God and this world that He had given Him. I think sometimes we're so distracted, even by devices in our pocket, right? Our phone's dinging, text messages, that we miss the gift of the present and the people that God has given us here and now.

Host (Jim Daly): Well, and I think what's so good in the book, you describe it as a process. It's not like you're born with this like athletic ability or something. But you learn to appreciate. You learn to savor. Um, it's more attitudinal than some genetic thing, right?

Guest (Female): Right. 100,000% it's a muscle that we have to develop and something that we have to learn to do. One thing that you can do to practice savoring, uh, is starting a gratitude journal. And and don't just write vague things, "I'm thankful for my family." Be very specific. What is it about your family? Who specifically in your family? And what are you thankful for? It's easy to focus on what we don't have, what happened in the past, what we're worried about in the future. But if we can stop for a few moments and be specifically grateful for what we have today, it tethers us to the present.

Host (Jim Daly): Well, and you say in the book, uh, developing gratitude and praise is so critical. Um, to the stogy person. I mean, it just happens, you know, things happen in your life, you become crusty. Yeah. Speak to that person at the end here. How does that crusty Christian? Let's put it in that context. Become more of a person of gratitude and praise.

Guest (Female): That crusty Christian is most likely someone who has been through a lot of pain because pain has a tendency to do that to us. It has a tendency to bring up our walls and make us feel justified to sit in our pain. But I always say that gratitude is how we rebel and decide, "Am I going to fixate on the pain, or am I going to fixate on the presents that God has given me here and now?"

Host (John Fuller): What a great message from Deborah Fileta, who's been our guest these past couple of days. And her book is a really powerful resource, Soul Care: Find Life-Giving Rhythms, Live Restored, Avoid Burnout, and Discover Unspeakable Joy. Well, recommend you get the book when you make a monthly pledge or a one-time gift of any amount to Focus on the Family today, we'll say thank you for joining the support team by sending it out to you. And our commitment is to provide you with practical, Bible-based advice and insight and encouragement for you and your family because we want to help you grow closer to God and to each other.

Host (Jim Daly): And John, I'm reminded of a comment we received from a mom named Lauren, uh, who described how her parents weren't well-equipped to raise her. And once Lauren became an adult and had a family of her own, she was looking for guidance on how to love her husband and children properly. And she said, "Focus on the Family has helped fill that void and so much more. I have found so many books, resources, and messages that have grown my faith, and Focus will help you and your family." That's so good to get that kind of testimony. That's what we're trying to do each and every day on this program and through the resources we've talked about. And now you can be part of the family building team when you give generously to this ministry. Like John said, a monthly pledge or one-time gift will really help us. And let's see what kind of impact God will allow us to have on more Lauren's and their families.

Host (John Fuller): Yeah, call today, 800, the letter A, and the word family, 800-232-6459, or donate and get Deborah's book, Soul Care, at focusonthefamily.com/weekend. And if today's conversation has raised any concerns about uh, issues in your own life that you're struggling with, we'd be happy to connect you with one of our caring Christian counselors. They're available to hear your story and pray with you and direct you to the help you need. And then a lot of families are traveling this summer. If that's you and you're anywhere near Colorado Springs, be sure to stop by for a visit. We'd love to show you the ministry and what God's been doing and allow you to kind of burn some steam off, let the kids run around in our play area, get some food at Whit's End Soda Shop, and see our wonderful bookstore. We've got all the details on the website. And thanks for listening to Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. I'm John Fuller, inviting you back as we once again help you and your family thrive in Christ.