Focus on the Family Parenting Podcast

Announcer: This month we're exploring the theme of how to grow in the midst of challenges, and I wonder if you respond well when your son or daughter brings a challenge on themselves through their own bad behavior. It's very easy for me to want to say, "See, I told you," or "That's why you shouldn't." Wrong move.

I'm John Fuller along with Dr. Danny Huerta. He's our vice president of parenting here at Focus on the Family, and we're going to hear now a conversation that Focus president Jim Daly had with Amber Lia and Wendy Speake. They've got a book called *Parenting Scripts: When What You're Saying Isn't Working, Say Something New*. You can check the show notes to find out more about that book. Here they are now, Jim Daly, Wendy Speake, and Amber Lia.

Jim Daly: The challenges of parenting can be tough. I enjoyed it even with the challenges. I tell young couples who are thinking, "Do we get a dog or do we have a baby?" Have a baby, because it's so much better. At the end of your life, you will be fully rewarded in that relationship with your children. We laugh about it, but seriously, don't let fear grip you. I don't think there's a challenge you can go through that you're not going to be a better person as a parent and have that child be a better young adult.

But speak to the challenges. We'll start there. Parenting is tough.

Wendy Speake: You know, I know that you brought us in to have a conversation with you, but during your opening there, I found myself just getting drawn in thinking, "Just remind us that's true, Jim. Just remind us."

That's Amber and my heart. We think of specifically our two parenting books, *Triggers*, which we've been here with you before and spoken about.

Jim Daly: And we'll attach that broadcast at the website so people can see both.

Wendy Speake: Really, we like to think of them as conversations. We are not the experts. We are in the trenches and have been in the trenches with you guys saying, "Here are the struggles."

To the mom that's crying, to the mom that's already feeling convicted, to the mom that already wants to throw in the towel: we've been there. What's the specific struggle? We're going to sit with you and we're just going to have a conversation with you about what God's word says, what a better response could be, and what the lousy responses were like. It's good you feel convicted.

That's really the heart of these parenting scripts. What have you been saying that's been ineffective? You feel bad about it. They feel bad about it. Maybe not just ineffective; they might actually be mean. So let's stop doing that and then let's be thoughtful. If you're going to have a thoughtful response, it means you need to actually think. This book is an invitation to slow down, sit down, and write down a better response before you need it.

Jim Daly: But you're raising the exact point of the parenting challenge because we don't think about it ahead of time and we tend to do to our children what we lived through as kids. That's why we always say the fruit doesn't fall far from the tree, because we're parenting like we were parented and we haven't stopped to think through, "Is this effective?" I can't remember who said it, but it's that great axiom that if you're repeating the same thing over and over trying to get a different result, it's crazy.

Wendy Speake: And so we're saying let's figure out where are we making that mistake over and over. Let's pinpoint that, let's take it one at a time and say, "What would a kinder and more effective and more God-honoring response be when my children..."

Jim Daly: Amber, let me have you on the parenting script idea. Roleplay something for us where the script is applied. It could be misbehavior or something like that. I say, "Stop that! Stop that! You're going to go to your room if you don't stop that." Give it three seconds. "You haven't stopped that. All right, now you're going to your room." Then you feel terrible as a parent because it doesn't work. The same behavior comes out. Take that typical emotional response that we as parents get into. I'm embarrassed to say so many times I got down there in the pigpen with the boys trying to convince them, and I'm sounding just like them.

Amber Lia: It's like we have resorted to their level instead of calling them to a more mature standard that we could model. I feel like we do that. We lower ourselves to this suddenly juvenile response just like we're mimicking them instead of calling them to actually listen to us and to obey.

It's really important because when you get into the heat of the moment, that is the knee-jerk response: just keep blubbering over your words, saying the same things that don't work. "I told you to do this!" or asking really dumb questions, let's be honest. Like, "Why do you keep doing that?" or "Why don't you listen to me?" Do we really expect that the child's going to come up with a really intelligent response in that moment? "Well, Father, my cortex is not responding exactly the way it should."

But that's what we do. "Why are you doing this?" So we really wanted to help parents first of all understand that you're not the only one that's struggling and doesn't always know what to say or says the wrong thing. You're not alone. Don't let the enemy heap a ton of shame and guilt on you. But Wendy and I say you've got to figure out what you mean to say before you say something mean.

Jim Daly: That's so right. Making the plan. Let me push you further. For example, the disobedient child. What's a script here just to give the listeners and the viewers a chance to hear it?

Amber Lia: With this script, the things that we do encourage parents to say are really rooted in biblical principles and even in scripture. That's where true transformation happens. There's no better script than Wendy's phrase, "Choose the word when you choose your words." That's really important.

When I have a child that's disobeying, I will say to them, "What happens when you disobey?" Instead of immediately going into a lesson or punishing them, I will just say, "Hey, what happens when you disobey, Ollie?" He's learned to say to me, "Well, things don't go well." I go, "That's right. So I wonder what will happen if you proceed to hit your brother, jump off that high wall, or take the car out without asking permission?"

Ephesians tells us in chapter 6, verses 2 through 3, "Children, honor your mother and your father that it may go well with you, that you may live a long life." In both the Old and New Testament, there's so many verses about children obeying their parents so that it will go well with them or so that they will have a long life. I've instilled in the boys—not perfectly, disclaimer—to remember when I ask you what happens when you disobey. I want them to reflect instead of just reject what I'm saying because I'm angry. It just gives them that opportunity.

Jim Daly: Force against force. Even as little children, they don't like being told things. It's right in our human nature called sin. So interesting.

John Fuller: Danny, I love the idea of having some scripts. You're really good; you've helped me over the years just be ready for certain things. You can't be ready for everything, but when a child has disobeyed and they need to face the consequences, I can think of two common parental responses. One is, "I'll step in because I don't want you to have to suffer even though I think you should. It's just too painful." Or, "See? You deserve this," and there's an element almost of shame. We don't want to go in either of those directions. How do we help our child understand, "I'm with this, I'm sorry, you've just got to deal with this"?

Danny Huerta: There are a lot of triggers that come when you put a boundary and it's crossed by your kids. You can take it personally very quickly and think, "They did this intentionally, they did it against me, they're so disobedient." Maybe there is a pattern of disobedience. If you can look at it from a perspective that they're having a hard time and it's not personal, it changes everything.

You can start off that way: "I can see this is very challenging for you. Just know that I love you and I want to guide you through this." Make sure you agree together on what the consequence is if there's a disobedience in a certain area—let's say it's phones, time outside of the house, or maybe they're texting and driving—different boundaries that you've put in place. What you want to do is agree to what's going to happen, and then you're just the enforcer of that. You're not impulsively putting some type of consequence in the moment because many times that creates more damage. You're coming in reactively and with big emotions and you're putting in consequences that are very hard to follow.

John Fuller: Let me jump in because about 20 years ago one of our boys was doing what teenage boys do, and that is pushing away from mom. She took it personally and she just gave this nuclear option of a consequence: "Don't do—you be home at ten!" That really created a lot of angst. How can I diffuse and respond well to the moment that I'm feeling disrespected or I just go off the handle? How do I get ahead of that?

Danny Huerta: It is tough. I heard what you're saying, that you want to have compassion and understand, "It must be hard for you." But if you have it already agreed upon ahead of time, you say, "Remember, remember this is what happens when you do that." You're not having to come up with something.

In the moment, if they do something that is disobedient, you say, "You knew the boundary. This is the consequence. I still love you. I'll see you on the other side." They still have a consequence in place. If you're needing some space to not come in with shame, usually it just takes 60 seconds to 120 seconds for you to catch your brain enough, take a deep breath, and figure out, "What am I trying to accomplish? Is it all about punishing or is it about guiding?"

John Fuller: I'm feeling that it was disrespect. That's really what was at the heart of it, and we hadn't talked about when you disrespect. That's a vague kind of thing. "When you disrespect your mom, this is what's going to have to happen. This is the consequence." So give me—if I could go back 20 years, everything's fine, this son loves his mom, it's all good—but if I could go back 20 years, I would have had a conversation that says, "This is how we respect Mom, and when you don't, this is what I'm going to have to do." How does that look? Give me the script for that.

Danny Huerta: First you say, "That was disrespectful," or "Don't disrespect my wife. She's also your mother. Don't disrespect her. When you do that, this is what happens." Maybe it's a loss of privilege.

Then you ask the question, "What is really going on?" Because that is hurtful to her, and I know when all the emotions are out of the way, you do truly love your mom, but there must be something you're angry about to go towards a place of disrespect. There's still a consequence—maybe it's losing the phone over the weekend or going out with friends for that weekend—certain things that parents need to come up with as far as the specific consequence that's meaningful for that particular child.

It's not all about fairness or that it needs to be uniform. It's about providing a stopping point and awareness, but also a connection point. That's one we miss where we go, "What's really going on? I'm upset at you, I'm frustrated with you, this is hurtful the way that you're treating my wife, and I'm upset at you, but I still love you and I want to know what's really going on." Doing so calmly and probably more than once even, just keep the connection. That's where we did do some things right. We kept the connection, and that's a crucial thing.

John Fuller: Earlier we mentioned Amber and Wendy's book, *Parenting Scripts*. It's going to give you the kind of thing I just got a download from Danny about. If your child is acting up and you want to stop the behaviors, this is a terrific resource for you to address them calmly and with some framework of how to best respond.

Make a donation of any amount today to the ministry of Focus on the Family, a monthly gift or a one-time gift, and we'll send the book *Parenting Scripts* to you. The starting point is the link in the show notes. We have a free online parenting assessment which is so easy and so beneficial for you. Thousands have taken this. It's quick, it's complete, and it's going to help you really evaluate your relationship with your children and how to take things to the next level. Check the show notes for that free online parenting assessment.

Next time we'll talk about the important topic of bullying and what to do if your child has been bullied. For now, on behalf of Dr. Danny Huerta and the entire team, I'm John Fuller, and thanks for joining us for the Focus on the Family Parenting Podcast.