Focus on the Family Marriage Podcast

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John Fuller: Aaron, has Greg ever gotten on your nerves even though he wasn't trying to? Was there something that he was doing that you just thought, "Must he do that?" This happened to me just the other night.

My dear wife has some orthodontic work. It's a long story, but she had this thing in her mouth, and there was this noise she was making. I just had to say, "I have sensory issues right now. I know you're not trying, but oh my goodness." It's not you, it's me.

I'm John Fuller along with Greg and Aaron Smalley. My bride is not here to defend herself, so let's move on. Greg and Aaron lead the marriage team here at Focus. Aaron, when a couple has a situation, maybe something as simple as what I just described or something bigger, more obvious, how do we begin the conversation to say, "You are really getting on my nerves"?

Aaron Smalley: I think our hope is that these small annoyances will just go away, but instead they compile. Each time it happens, we build more and more resentment or bitterness, or we distance or shut down.

I'm laughing because Greg has this thing. He has this water bottle that when he drinks from it, it goes "glug, glug, glug." So it goes down and it is so annoying, just the sound of it. Of course, Greg would never know that unless I would tell him that.

Greg Smalley: Which she does.

Aaron Smalley: Well, I finally did after six months. I was like, "I am going to rip that bottle out of his hands and I am going to toss it straight out the window." But of course, that is mine to manage.

I can let him know, "Hey, that's really just grating my nerves." And he's been so kind because he'll look at me when he's about to chug it and try to make it quiet. It doesn't work.

Greg Smalley: It works good enough because I don't hear it quite the same. It's what I want to be, John: good enough.

John Fuller: At least you're making noises. For me, Dina will just come up and she'll push on the corners of my mouth because I have this genetic tendency to scowl or frown. My smile muscles need to be juiced up and activated more. She'll see me and just come up like, "Come on, raise those cheeks. Smile. Come on now, you can smile."

Greg Smalley: I'm sure you love that when that happens.

John Fuller: Well, I know it irritates her when she sees this across the table. Lighten up, John.

Aaron Smalley: The important thing is when we don't bring these things up, we begin to form these negative beliefs, and it's probably something bigger than the sound a water bottle makes. These things begin to compile, and then we start seeing our spouse through that negative lens.

Then that influences our connection. It's important. It is all in how you do it. If you can do it kindly and with graciousness, letting your spouse know, "Hey, I've got some feedback for you, when would be a good time?"

Then if they're willing and open, then to proceed kindly. Not talking about them, attacking their character, but describing the behavior that is separate from who they really are. Because otherwise, it does impact us. Negative beliefs are killers to any relationship because everything you believe about somebody, you're going to find evidence of it.

John Fuller: That's good. And what you just said a moment or two ago is so important. "I've got some feedback, let me know when." Last episode I talked about the espresso machine. I just blurted it out. I'm standing in front of the machine and I just blurted out, "Did you know that this is like this?" So that wasn't asking, "Hey..."

Greg Smalley: Did she leave the grounds in the machine?

John Fuller: No, she left the frosting pitcher full of water and she left something else over here. I wasn't even using the pitcher. It didn't even matter to me, but I've got this thing. She said, "I think you're kind of OCD on this." And I said, "I think I kind of am."

The point here is there are ways that you can make sure that you're heard without offending the other person or making it all about them and their heart and character. Let's go ahead and hear some ways that we can think the better of our spouse. Jim Daly talked with Ted Lowe.

Jim Daly: Let's hit that issue of the theological basis for this. I teased it in the beginning, but you're the pastor. So when you're talking about positivity in marriage, that can be misconstrued. What's the theological underpinning for the idea that being positive in your marriage is biblical?

Ted Lowe: You go to Philippians 4:8 and just run your spouse through the Philippians 4:8 filter, which starts with "whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is pure, whatever is right." The fact that that verse starts with "true" is really a great protector of anyone who's being abused psychologically or physically. If that's true, then that can't be, right?

This is not about rose-colored glasses. This is not about just saying "I'm going to fake it" or not communicating, but it starts with what's true. And then it goes to what's noble, what's pure, what's right, what's lovely. If anything is worthy of praise, think on those things. I think when people have a running list of what you love about your spouse, it postures us to love our spouse in a way that we would never naturally love them on our own.

Jim Daly: Why does the simplicity of being positive have such a strong impact on us? It's kind of a "duh" question, but somebody might be thinking it.

Ted Lowe: One study shows that 80% of our thoughts are negative and 90% of them are repetitive, and that we have between 16,000 to 60,000 thoughts a day. With all that going on, with all that negativity going on, when we stop and we get positive and we take captive, when we transform our marriage by transforming our mind, by renewing our minds, it changes things.

We start to see things through a different lens. That was the thing I got so passionate about writing this book because I didn't want to write another book. I've had ADHD since long before it was cool to have it. I did not want to, but what I was finding, I thought, "People need to know this."

It changed our marriage and it changed my life to start thinking this way because I don't naturally have positive thoughts about myself or even about my wife. I'm a little bit more of a critical thinker in that way, but when you start changing them and focusing them through God's lens, it just changes things.

Jim Daly: Why do you think that is? I get it, we're in a fallen world and sin entered the world, and that may be the answer, but why do you think we lean so easily toward negativity as human beings rather than toward something that I would describe as more godly, more positive? Especially as Christians, we can be some of the most critical people on the face of this earth.

Ted Lowe: Depending on who you're listening to, a lot of secular research would say that our brains are hard-wired to protect ourselves. We're looking for the things that can hurt us all the time. Our brains are wired naturally that way in this world, that something's going to come after me. Our brains are not wired looking for joy. They're wired to be protective, and so we have to re-wire them.

That's why scripture is so clear. I got so excited about that just to think that our relationship with Jesus can really transform us by us filling His love for us and remembering and focusing on that, and focusing on who He is. It's just powerful.

John Fuller: Greg, somebody's listening thinking, "Okay, I can do better. I'm really focusing too much on the negative," but there's so much of it. It's just so easy to focus on the negative. Coach them along to take some steps to say, "It's actually the positives I want to focus on."

Greg Smalley: It's certainly obvious what our spouse is doing. When I gurgle my water bottle, that's obvious. The mistake is if all we ever do is look to what they're doing—how do I stop them, get them to do this, don't do that. The problem is that perhaps you're missing the only part of that that you can control, which is you.

It would be maybe for Aaron to even think about what is going on for me that that just drives me crazy. Now, this is a funny example, so there are bigger issues, more damaging issues to where we have stuff that we're bringing to the table within that of why it bothers me so much.

That's what we're trying to first and foremost think about is, am I contributing to this? If there's some part of that annoyance that I'm responsible for or that I'm bringing to the table, I can deal with that. It's just trying to separate out what is truly what Aaron is doing that's annoying me versus here's the stuff that I'm bringing to the table.

It's just a good part of the conversation that's responsible. It's good for me to think about what am I doing here to exacerbate my level of frustration because that I actually do have some control over.

John Fuller: What I so appreciate about what you're expressing there is this fits for all of us in all of our relationships. I remember there was a time when one of my sons looked at me and said, "She is really hard to deal with." He was pointing to mom. I said, "Well, she's not going anywhere, so what are you going to do about you?" Because you can't change her. You're not going to change her. And unless you move, this is what you're dealing with.

Greg Smalley: See, that's the kind of stuff you guys talk about on Practice Makes Parent.

John Fuller: It is.

Aaron Smalley: These are cross-pollinating podcasts. Love it.

John Fuller: I love what you're saying because there is application for marriage but also all of our relationships. This really helps me to say, "This is a small potato thing. This isn't a big deal. This is a minor irritation because you still love the Lord, you still read your Bible, you still show up in prayer, you still have a heart for kids." I try to really accentuate the positive, which crowds out the negative, doesn't it?

Greg Smalley: Which is really a big part of the battle. Sure, I can figure out how I am contributing to this. But Aaron talked about negative beliefs early on, and I need to attack that directly. So if over time I start to see her through a negative lens and I'm now only noticing the stuff that she's doing that frustrates me or irritates me...

I can still then ask God, "Show me who Aaron is through Your eyes. What am I missing here?" It's hard for me to see beyond the hurt, the pain, the annoyance. "God, what am I missing? Speak to me, show me, who is she really?"

You can also do that by really noticing the things that she does that I'm grateful for. She brought me a drink today here at Focus. She brought some food that I could share, and I forgot to bring any kind of food, and so she had some. She shared that with me.

John Fuller: Thoughtfulness. Small gestures.

Greg Smalley: I can now notice that and go, "Yeah, maybe she did something also to hurt me or annoy me today, but thank you for sharing your food." You didn't have to do that, and I really appreciate that. Thank you for bringing me that drink, too. The more we do that, that's how we combat the negative beliefs.

Aaron Smalley: But I will still go back to, oftentimes people believe the better thing to do is to not say anything. But your spouse doesn't know. They have no idea what's going on inside of you. It's taking that risk, doing it in a way they might hear you to give you the best chance of being heard.

And when your spouse comes to you to share something like that, be grateful and say, "Hey, thank you so much for telling me. I didn't know." Deal with you, because it could stir something up, but gratitude for them taking the risk to tell you. Because it's better than letting it stay inside and then bitterness sets in and distance and tension builds in the relationship. I'd rather know.

Greg Smalley: Let me push back on that a little bit. The research shows that for every one negative you point out, you need to also observe 20 good things your spouse is doing. Sometimes people get caught in, "The only time I'm ever going to give you feedback is when you're doing something to annoy me or irritate me." As long as you're aware that that can't be the only thing you're bringing up. I know you're not saying that.

Aaron Smalley: Yes, but most people are shocked at that ratio because often we hear five to one.

Greg Smalley: 20 to one.

Aaron Smalley: So it's got to be in balance. You've got to be affirming and noticing the positives. If you're not noticing positives, like Greg said, pray and ask the Lord to show them to you.

John Fuller: That's a warning sign. You should absolutely be praying because you are absorbed in yourself and you're not thinking clearly to seek after the good. For follow-up on this, if you want to do a deep dive, get the book by Ted Lowe called Us in Mind: How Changing Your Thoughts Can Change Your Marriage. It's an excellent resource.

Support the ministry and support this show with a donation of any amount, and we'll send the book to you. Details are in the show notes. We're also going to link over to the show that Greg and Aaron host, Crazy Little Thing Called Marriage, which is an excellent marriage resource.

You two have really poured yourselves into this show. It's fun to hear you because I know you, and I feel like this is even a bigger reveal of who you are.

Greg Smalley: We tell more stories and more annoyances about each other than we do here.

Aaron Smalley: And how much we love each other.

John Fuller: This show is great and it's part of the Focus on the Family Podcast Network. Check it out and give it a listen. By the way, we've always got something going on. Beyond the podcast that Greg and Aaron host, we have a new digital radio station featuring Christian music. It's on the Godcaster app, and we'll link to it in the show notes.

Next time, Tim and Kathy Bush share a really incredible story of overcoming infidelity. For now, on behalf of Greg and Aaron and the entire team, thanks for joining us for the Focus on the Family Marriage Podcast.