Countdown 2 Eternity

Guest (Male): Welcome once again to Countdown to Eternity with Pastors James Kaddis and Tom Hughes. A weekly radio ministry from Calvary Chapel Signal Hill. Together, Tom and James examine current events and connect what's going on in our world to Bible prophecy. Let's lean in and listen.

James Kaddis: Well, hello, my dear brothers and sisters. I want to welcome you to another episode of Countdown to Eternity. First, I want to ask that you not mind my voice. It's a little out today, but that's because I've been doing a lot of talking, maybe because I have a big mouth. And I am with the great Tom Hughes. This is going to be a good one. I'm telling you, bro.

Tom Hughes: This is going to be fantastic.

James Kaddis: We have to talk about the elephant in the room. I’m not talking about me. My short Mexican friend. Bro, what is happening lately? What's been going on? A lot of people have been in a panic. Things have been in disarray. The Middle East is going crazy on top of that. And it’s just been nuts. I mean, wild. So, what do we want to pick at first?

Tom Hughes: Well, I have all kinds of things to talk to you about, James. We have socialism in America. We have the Flock cameras. You've heard about those, right? We can go into that. The C9 bill in Canada is very concerning. It's coming to America whether people believe it or not. We can talk about that. And we can talk about this other subject: Israel and the US.

I'll just say this, everybody. James is going to get lit up today. I predict it.

James Kaddis: The only advantage that we may have with respect to me not being so lit up is the fact that my voice is a bit under the weather. So, I might not be as energetic as I normally am. Well, I might not sound that way, but I think this is going to prove to be one of those very unique, interesting conversations.

Tom Hughes: It'll be great. I'm certain of that. Either way, it's going to be fantastic, I'll guarantee that. By the way, when's the next time coming up at Calvary Chapel Signal Hill on a Sunday night?

James Kaddis: Bro, you were going to give me that date.

Tom Hughes: I didn't give it to you? Oh, man. Okay. I'll send it to you right after we're done here. I'll send you a text. We'll do that. I sure hope it's in August. It will need to be. I have a screening for a documentary that we put together. We started filming it a year ago. This is so exciting. KGB's Most Wanted is what the documentary is.

I'm not kidding. We went and we had lunch with the whole family. The dad was arrested in Russia. He spent 20 years in Russian prisons three different times because he was a pastor. He got arrested because of Jesus.

James Kaddis: Who's the guy, bro? What's his name?

Tom Hughes: I'm not telling you yet. I am not going to tell you yet. But we did that. We filmed it a year ago. We just finished it and we're going to do a screening of it. We think the screening is going to be in August. You're going to meet his daughter in Santa Barbara. I have not announced it yet.

I'm going to do an interview with her. You're going to meet her and if I can get her dad there also, you'll meet him too. He is, and it's going to be an incredible time in Santa Barbara. We're also going to do a screening for the documentary, and we believe that'll probably be a week or two before. It will be a Sunday night before the Santa Barbara conference.

James Kaddis: They are fantastic people. I got to spend some time with them. They are wonderful people. That's going to be a great documentary. I just want to prep everybody. Just make sure you have a bunch of paper towels or napkins because you’re going to all cry. I'm telling you, it’s a phenomenal story and people need to wake up to what's happening.

Tom Hughes: As we see, we're going to talk about socialism in America. I don't know if we're going to do it today or next week, but we're going to get there. This whole story, KGB's Most Wanted, is very insightful to what's happening right now. And the warning is you better wake up. America better wake up.

James Kaddis: I think that's a great idea for next week. We should sit down and literally have, we should dedicate the conversation to what is going to come out there. I think that's a great idea.

Tom Hughes: Next week, that's what we'll do. We can talk about the Flock camera system. We can talk about the C9. We should probably talk about the C9 in Canada next week, too, because it really is going to feed into this socialism thing. And we might as well talk about this one: Israel and the United States.

James Kaddis: Bro, what's happening? Tell me your perspective on this.

Tom Hughes: This is when everybody's going to get wound up. So, here's what I say. There are only two possibilities with what's going on with Israel and the US. Number one is that Trump and Netanyahu are getting along very well behind the scenes and they are playing a game.

The only other option is that they are not getting along very well and Israel is being intentionally or unintentionally isolated with the thought of bringing peace to the Middle East by Trump. There aren't really any other options. You might think of a third one, but I can't think of any others. It's one or the other.

James Kaddis: I think it is one or the other and there are derivatives that come from each of those places. I have to tell you, I want to be on the side of everybody. I don't want to be on the side of everybody. My natural instinct tells me probably we should panic because of some of the things that are happening and some of the things that we're seeing. But there's this part of me that recognizes a pattern that I just can't deny. It's very difficult to deny.

And to a degree, I almost feel vindicated in a way, not that I want vindication because of US action in Iran. But there is something about this that is relatively vindicating. One thing is certain. What's happened in Lebanon right now, which is something that I called, I said this would happen. I recognized that Lebanon would become the new battlefield.

What's happening in Lebanon no way could happen if it had not been for coordination between the President and Bibi Netanyahu, especially with the agreement that's being signed. Lebanon is not going to agree to go full steam forward against Hezbollah and any proxy of Iran if it doesn't have a certain set of guarantees made to it, especially in the southern portion and especially in parts of Beirut.

This is especially true of the area where the President has a lot more influence. And this is the part that may end up touching Turkey and the part that's going to end up touching whatever Joulani is messing with right now. Hay'at Tahrir al-Sham has a lot to do with it. The fact that the President of Turkey, as we'll call him, we'll just call him the President of Turkey for now, is dealing with a bit of unmitigated freedom because the resistance that he would normally have experienced from people like the PKK is now gone.

The Kurds have become somewhat irrelevant, simply because they're being held at bay. I think that there is potentially a purpose for them maybe later, but it's not one that's given as part of a stated plan for anything. And I think that there is also a carrot and stick mechanism that's being deployed right now when it comes to a series of these players.

Especially with the statement that the President made regarding Erdogan where he believed Erdogan would be very happy with the arms deal that he's about to make with them. It's a dangerous game. It's a very, very dangerous game. But I think there's a lot of ruses that we're seeing here. There's a lot of smoke and mirrors that we're actually looking at, and it's a very complicated geopolitical position that we find ourselves in.

So, with that said, if somebody comes to me with the different doom and gloom view that I have been opposing from the very beginning of this, I don't blame them for seeing it that way. I think that there's legitimate reasons for people to feel like that. So, I'm not condemning the person that would take that view. I just think the lens that we have to view it through has to be through one that's very nuanced instead of some of the derivatives that are coming from this.

So, I am very curious to know, Tommy, because I haven't talked to you since. What is your view about what you're seeing right now? I'm really interested to know because definitely I value your insight and am kind of curious because this is becoming a lot more complicated than anybody ever foresaw it becoming. I kind of saw this happening. I had a feeling this would take place. But it's happening so rapidly and so differently than what has been articulated historically that it leaves room for a lot of concern.

Tom Hughes: Yes. So, we know what the end is going to be. Israel is going to be isolated. We know that's what the Bible says. So, we know it's going to happen. Is this the start-up to that? Because we are watching as we look at AI technology, we look at digital currency, digital ID, we look at all of the different things that are happening, all of them that are happening.

The wokism that has completely infected the entire West. You look at all of these things that are happening, it leads me to believe that this train of the last days is gaining speed going down the track and it's going fast and it's about ready to come to the end of the cliff. So, that leads me to believe that we are in the days of watching Israel being isolated.

We are watching a turning from the Gentiles and God is turning His attention to Israel again. They are not saved yet, and I want to say this. There's always a remnant of Jewish believers in Yeshua, Jesus. But we do know biblically that Israel must be in a place of unbelief before the tribulation begins because it's during the tribulation period when God has His talk with them, so to speak, and He draws them to Himself.

So, as we watch what's happening right now, it's not about if I sound like a Christian Zionist. I would say, well, I am, but it's not about political Zionism or whatever political Zionism is. It's the same thing that you would say, James. We both believe that God has a covenant with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. He reiterated it with Joshua and with others.

We know that it's legitimate. It's never ending. It's everlasting. And we do know what the end is going to be also. So, we can both project to the end. So, where are we right now on the time frame of that? I believe the opposite. I don't believe that this whole thing did not go the way that was originally intended with the war.

I think that before Trump became President, in fact before I voted for him in November, before I voted for him, I said the one challenge I have in my mind with Trump is the Abraham Accords and I said I believe as soon as he steps into office, his focus is going to be on the Abraham Accords. It's going to be gathering together the Gulf states and the others. Then obviously we can see what's going on with the Gaza peace plan. We keep hearing about it and so forth.

So, I believe Trump at all costs wants to bring about a peace in the Middle East and that has to include Iran. It has to include all of these different players. I'm troubled by different things that Trump has said. And if he said them in jest and he's playing games with Netanyahu, it was an extremely foolish thing to say when he said Israel wouldn't exist if it wasn't for me. He said that three times. He reiterated it last week when he said something like, "This is the greatest war that's ever been executed," or whatever his exact words were. I can't remember.

"I've eliminated the nuclear threat. I've come to do what I said I was going to do." And then he reiterated, "If it wasn't for me, Israel wouldn't exist. And if it wasn't for me, the entire Middle East wouldn't exist." So, when I hear this, wait a minute. God says, "Behold, I am the keeper of Israel. I neither slumber nor sleep." I look at those words, James, and I see this is somebody saying, "No, God, I've got this."

It's a Nebuchadnezzar statement. It's not a Cyrus statement. It's a Nebuchadnezzar statement. I'm concerned about Trump also. Nebuchadnezzar, his spiritual advisor was Daniel the Prophet, who didn't always listen to him. Trump's got a spiritual advisor named Paula White. And I look at some of the dynamics, I'm very concerned with what I see happening.

That's just that. I mean, then we can go into the other details like Qatar. You probably have more information on this than I do. I listen to you and I listen to David Tal. I lean more towards what David says. But David had mentioned the other day that this agreement, the MOU, has Qatar and Pakistan as the peacekeepers in Lebanon and they're the ones that can determine what Israel's response can be. Exactly what that entails, I don't know. You probably have more details than me.

James Kaddis: I think it's the general assumption about the players that are involved in trying to facilitate some type of peace agreement because Qatar has been the country that's been facilitating some of the conversations. That's where some of it's been generally located. And also, Pakistan has been.

So, they've been the two mediators or moderators. And the problem with that is that thesis doesn't hold if you take it as far as you're describing it only because of the fact that Qatar just came out and made a statement standing in solidarity with Kuwait and standing in solidarity with Bahrain. Now, if they stood in solidarity with Kuwait and Bahrain, that's a strict condemnation on the actions of Iran in attacking them and they immediately removed themselves from some kind of a trusted position by the IRGC.

The IRGC is actually beginning to look at Qatar as yet another enemy. They've already declared the UAE as an enemy combatant. So, this whole situation is becoming a lot more complicated than a lot of people are thinking through. The one thing I will tell you about the Nebuchadnezzar draw, I think it's a mistake when people begin to try to draw parallels between Trump and Nebuchadnezzar and Trump and Cyrus, only because of the fact that yes, there are some similarities that exist with either of those kings and what President Trump has done.

But there are too many issues that don't carry as similarly speaking to be able to draw that. And the reason why I discourage people from drawing parallels because this has been a big talk lately in the chats I've been seeing it, you know, is Trump a Cyrus or is Trump a Nebuchadnezzar? And my view has been be careful to draw those parallels because he's a very unique person in history that can't fall into either of those categories for a lot of different reasons.

And perhaps the most consequential of which center around who Nebuchadnezzar was and what happened with him into that time. And also as dangerous as it is for people to get mad at me when I make a statement like this, I would never, ever defend what Trump said when he said, "If it wasn't for me, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah." It's just nonsense, right? Like you, that's a crazy statement to make because as believers we know if it wasn't for the Lord then that's the case.

But number one, Trump's not a believer. Number two, every single time he made that assertion, he made that assertion within even though it's wrong, he made that assertion within the context of nuclear weapons. The idea that he was trying to communicate was nuclear weapons will obliterate everybody in the neighborhood. So, because we bombed whatever Iran or whatever, these people are not going to be blown off the face of the earth.

That is not a justification for Trump making the statement that he made. It's inappropriate. I don't agree with it. I think that he probably could do better for himself in not making statements like that. Granted, he could do better for himself by not having spiritual advisors around him, many of whom like Paula White, she’s just, she’s really not, I mean, she’s not a Bible person.

Tom Hughes: She's a tramp. That's what she is.

James Kaddis: Yeah, she's not good people on many levels. Okay. And I'm not one to want to even waste my energy, my precious time on having to run down somebody that's just so clearly blatantly off her rocker. Okay. With that said, the bigger question has to be asked. What's actually happening right now? Like, what is it that we're actually seeing?

And I'm going to tell you this because I think it's really important. You have to look at the pattern that Trump continues to demonstrate. And the pattern is very simple. This is what he does. It's only a few steps. He applies maximum pressure. That's exactly what he does. He starts by applying overwhelming pressure in one way or another. He'll use sanctions, he'll use threats, he'll definitely create a military posture that's very, very overwhelming.

He'll create public warnings. He does all that stuff. Certainly will do diplomatic isolation. He'll put pressure on other countries and other leaders to isolate themselves from the person that he's targeting in the moment. He doesn't begin by begging anybody to negotiate. He's never done that. He creates maximum pressure.

After maximum pressure is created, what he always does is he forces the players to reveal themselves. When he did this the first time with the Abraham Accords, he created maximum pressure on the PA and then he even put East Jerusalem on the table, which is something everybody got offended by. He knew they weren't going to take it. He forced them to come out of their doghouse to basically say we're not going to do it.

So, he forces the players to reveal themselves. Once the maximum pressure is put into place, everyone has to react. Iran exposes its weakness. They continue to expose its weakness when pressure like this is being put up. The Arab states are forced to reveal whether they want stability or chaos. It's their decision.

The GCC is forced to react. Europe is being forced to react. They usually complain and that's exactly what they're doing here. They're showing their face. That's why NATO is in grave danger right now. And of course, Israel gains a lot of room to maneuver when that process is happening.

The third thing that he does, and this is where it really begins to change things, is he will back Israel. He eventually backs Israel and he isolates the radicals. He's done it every single time. He makes it clear that Israel is not the villain. And he will eventually do that. He's beginning to do that right now while Iran and Hamas and Hezbollah and all the radical elements become the obvious destabilizers. That's what's happening right now.

It's becoming more and more obvious and that in essence changes the whole conversation. Then what he does is the one that gets everybody freaked out. And that's when he announces that he's going to turn this crisis into a deal. That's what he does every single time. He takes the chaos, he uses the chaos in one way or another to push some larger agreement, whether it be normalization, security cooperation, all that. That's what he's doing with the GCC right now.

And the final product is framed as some kind of a strong producing peace, not a place of weakness. It ends the whole endless diplomacy nonsense because what ends up happening is when that coalition is formed, whoever attacks that coalition becomes villainized. So, he does pressure, exposure, he isolates people, he announces a deal, and then when no one wants to play, he fully reacts in a way that causes everybody to walk in a coalition.

That's exactly what he's doing right now with the GCC. And by the way, if you're a student of Bible prophecy, which is what we should be looking at, we should be looking at what the Bible says is going to happen in the future, you recognize that Sheba and Dedan are the open objectors of the attack on Israel. Well, right now what I think we may be seeing is we may be seeing the formation of the coalition that's being spoken about that speaks against all of the nations of Ezekiel 38.

You have to have the GCC intact walking hand in hand with Israel. And you tell me, brother, when was the last time we ever saw open-ended military action taken hand in hand with the UAE and Israel? There are IDF in the UAE with Iron Dome batteries that are defending the position of the UAE and Saudi Arabia is asking for a piece of that action.

So, it's not as simple as Trump has turned his back on Israel. I think there's a lot of manipulating going on and I am convinced based on what I'm seeing, especially with how the GCC is reacting towards Israel and how Beirut is right now working hand in hand with Bibi, that the President is the puppet maker in this one.

I mean, God is the ultimate puppet maker, obviously. But I think that what's happening is all of this that's been going on with the MOU and all of that other nonsense, and I'm going to say something even crazier, has been a tool for the President to create the time window that he needed to remobilize whatever he needs to remobilize. And I don't know if you noticed but we have more assets now in the Persian Gulf than we did in the beginning of all of this.

Tom Hughes: Yeah, that's pretty well known. But when I look at it, here's what I know. When this is over, one of us is going to be wrong and one of us is going to be right because there are no other options. There's different ways they can both play out, but there's no other option. I have a hard time with it for various reasons.

Another one would be when I watch this Trump thing has gone back and forth. It's just been deal, no deal, cease-fire, no cease-fire. And it's just back and forth. There hasn't been anything definitive from my perspective. I think Trump did this the way he approached his real estate deals and his business deals. I'm going to come in, I'm going to overwhelm them with look, if you don't do this with me, it's not going to go good for you.

So, massive amounts of military build-up, maybe more than ever before at that one time in such a short time. And I've also just seen it was Hormuz Shariat who put it so well not specifically about this war, well, actually earlier in the war, was when you go back to the Book of Daniel, you have the Prince of Persia and the Prince of Persia delays Gabriel to give the answer to Daniel. 21 days he was delayed.

The Prince of Persia is still hovering over Persia and they still have this prince of delay, this demonic presence. They've got it mastered. They're geniuses at it. And this is from my perspective, this is what I see happening. They also with the IRGC leadership, you have this whole 12th Imam thought.

So, do what you want. It's not the same, as you know, not every Islamic person is thinking about this from this 12th Imam perspective where we're going to create this massive chaos, massive war so our Mahdi is going to appear or whatever it is. So, it's different. It's not the same. And when I look at Trump, regardless of Nebuchadnezzar or Cyrus, I've thought of him even before the war started as more of a King Jehu.

So, King Jehu comes along. He did some great reforms for the Jews. He did great reforms for them. However, he never came into that place of knowing God and he had some serious failures. He's someone that you would like because he brought some great victories for Israel but also we had some great spiritual failures that were disastrous.

So, but as we move forward with this, one of us will be wrong, one of us will be right and the other one's going to owe the other pizza.

James Kaddis: You’re going to buy me stadium pizza when I go over there.

Tom Hughes: I'd probably buy that for you anyway so let's separate that from this.

James Kaddis: But I do want to say this because I think it's really important, okay? This is the part that perhaps bothers me more than anything and that is so many of those that are influential on the conservative side, on our side. I don't even want to use the term conservative because conservatism is so broken right now, it's darn near dead on many levels.

But those of us that are in this very small world of Bible prophecy, teachers, watchers, believers, there's this almost instant desire to want to completely ignore every wonderful thing that's happened with respect to Israel in a very short period of time. And I think that the problem here is if everything just ended and stayed the way it was right now, like literally we froze it in time and everything stayed where it was, it's in a thousand times better place than it was a year ago.

Tom Hughes: It looks to me the opposite. I'm very interested to hear how you say it looks the opposite. When I look at this war, you look at all the issues with the Strait of Hormuz that have taken place and are still taking place, they're not done yet. And I look and go what I've seen is thousands, countless thousands, we don't even know how many yet were killed in Iran and are still being killed by the IRGC in Iran. It's happening every day.

James Kaddis: But that’s in the media. They've been doing this literally every day. If you think 40,000 people is a lot in one shot, Iran has been doing this 10 times as much not being watched.

Tom Hughes: James, I know a lot about Iran. I'm a partner with Iran Alive and Hormuz Shariat. I know a lot about it. I know that's been going on. But nobody can tell me that prior to the war it started happening in the levels that it was happening when they were slaughtering the it has gone up exponentially from that time. And the antisemitism has increased exponentially also since the war. And I'm not saying the antisemitism is because of Trump but we still see this.

And here's the other problem. I think Trump thought this was going to be a short war. I really do. And I think his intentions were all good going in. I really do. And I said this when the MOU first came out, didn't say it on your program, but I said it a couple of times on mine that I think Trump's reaction will be because Iran's not going to play. We know that. They're radical.

So, Trump's reaction will be to obliterate Iran. And whatever the reason is, either because you're right or I'm right, either way Iran is going to be eliminated from a great power because it becomes a proxy during this time of the Ezekiel 38 invasion. And we also know somehow it has to get to a place for Ezekiel 38 verse 11 where Russia, Turkey, and Iran are not a threat. So, I guess it comes down to whether you're right or I'm right. Either way we both see the end result and that this massive threat of Iran will have to be eliminated.

James Kaddis: Right. I listen, I agree. And I also think at the same time that a lot of the people doing analysis on this are oversimplifying the variables because they don't have all the variables. And the bigger problem here, look, here's the big problem with analysis of geopolitics in the Middle East. Context is very difficult to be able to understand.

And the reason why it's difficult to understand is a lot of people don't understand the Islamic mindset, the Islamic culture. And although a lot of people right now are spending an inordinate amount of time talking about and studying the 12th Imam and learning about Shiite Islam, they don't fully understand how it practically applies especially within the context of geopolitical analysis.

So, there's a lot of foregone conclusions. And all I've been saying is we don't know what we don't know. And that's the problem. There's a lot of intelligence we don't have in our hands regarding this. And what I am saying, because I think that I can reasonably come to this conclusion, is that Israel is in a safer place today than it was a year ago. That's an indisputable fact.

Tom Hughes: I wouldn't deny that because I mean I know how the Bible plays out there. God's going to keep Israel, we get that. And also, we do know the closer we get to that time, the very warriors in Israel are going to become stronger and stronger. We can see that from Zechariah chapter 12. Even the feeble person will be like David on the day of battle. So, there's no doubt Israel is going to get stronger and stronger.

Wholeheartedly. And maybe that's what part of the spiritual dynamic is as God is working with Israel. But we also know this. Israel has to be isolated, and I'm not saying that in a joyful way. I absolutely am not. I do not like what I see happening. I don't smile when I see these things happening. I do understand the last days. I do understand Jesus is coming again. Listen, you and I get that more than almost anybody that's out there talking about this stuff.

James Kaddis: I agree. But I also believe that there's a danger of us reading into this not recognizing the fact that the isolation that we talk about with respect to Israel, according to passages like Zechariah 12:3, Zechariah 12:2 and 12:3, all relate to something that develops after a condition of peace has settled in.

So, the world sentiment of antisemitism is an issue that we have expected to be on the rise. We think it will continue to grow. But the geopolitics that rest within the Middle East itself is where we have to place a majority of the analysis. The big mistake that a lot of people are making right now when they're talking about all this stuff is they're looking at the worldwide reaction but not really understanding that the worldwide reaction with respect to the world that we know today geography-wise is somewhat superfluous compared to what's happening directly North, South, East, West of Israel.

And what we know in the short term is that there's going to have to be a condition of peace that settles in before any of this literally manifests itself in a very, very ugly way. As a matter of fact, the picture that's drawn with respect to Jerusalem is one that's really interesting because if you look at the Hebrew language and you look at the way it's written, it talks about the idea that people are going to want to lift Jerusalem up.

But Jerusalem's going to become this burdensome stone. They're going to break their backs lifting Jerusalem up. So the idea behind being able to understand all of this is to recognize that the kind of alignments that we're watching right now are very temporarily based because in the short term, and I think this is the part where it's very difficult to try to explain to the average person, the Bible seems to indicate that some kind of condition of peace or at least perceived security must settle in before the next major prophetic developments fully materialize.

And that's what I'm looking for in the immediate moment. And I think that's where we're going. And I think the only way that happens, which is where I've been wrong, this is where I've been wrong when I've said the only way that happens. I can be wrong about that. But it would appear as though we have never seen a person come on the scene that is as polarizing as President Trump who's been so capable of effectively getting a coalition of Mid-East leaders to think about Israel in a different way.

And I think that's what's happening right now. I don't think him going to the Middle East on his first trip for his second presidency was him catering to the money of Qatar or to the mindset of multiple leaders in the GCC. I think it was him going out of his way to secure the type of deals that would join the United States of America at the hip with all of those countries so that if an election came into play that pulled Trump or Trump-like thinkers out of the position, the GCC would no longer feel naked. They would feel supported. And I think that what the President has been doing is showing them that Israel and their relationship with Israel is the only way they're going to find that kind of security. That's what I think is happening right now.

Tom Hughes: Okay. So, I know we're out of time, but I just want to say this. And who knows, this might roll over to next week. But one of the challenges is in Zechariah chapter 12, Israel becomes this burdensome stone, a cup of drunkenness all the nations are gathered against her. So, we know Israel's going to be isolated. It's right after that that you have, it's in that context, and this is where the challenge is in interpreting the placing the time.

It's in the context when everybody's hating on them that the feeble rise up like David. Israel's soldiers rise up and give Israel a victory. The problem is after the pseudo-peace of Antichrist or Ezekiel 38 verse 11, either of those, Israel is rescued by the Lord. They are not rescued by their own Davids that are rising up. They're rescued by the Lord. So there's two different things that still have to happen. And one of them is peace, but one of them it appears to be before that as the nations coming against Israel.

Now, there can be a peace, there can be a peace before the peace because there's lots of different agreements, no doubt about that. And it could be a peace that sets up the nations to turn against them. But when that the fake peace of Ezekiel 38:11 or the fake peace of Antichrist comes, either of those, it's not the IDF rising up. It is the Lord who rescues in both cases.

James Kaddis: 100%. And the fake peace of Ezekiel 38 I think becomes the predecessor to what people will believe is the more permanent peace of the Antichrist. I think they ordered that way. I think a lot of people, if we're still here, if we're not raptured by then, I think there's going to be even greater confusion when we get to that point.

Yeah, and that's what I think is happening. My thing is I don't see a person like Trump just flipping overnight. You know, it's funny, we talk a lot about the things that JD is saying, but JD could very easily be seen reverting back to old views that he used to carry. Trump isn't reverting back to anything. These are views that he's had from the time he was talking about it 40 years ago. So, my point behind it is to the best of my ability, if I were to frame it one way or another, I would probably say global antisemitism as we've been talking, it's the atmosphere.

That's probably the best way of putting it. The Bible tells us that. Global antisemitism is in essence the atmosphere, but Middle East alignment that we're seeing right now becomes the prophetic mechanism. And that probably sounds even more confusing than what I had first said. But I think the world's hatred of Israel is not irrelevant. I'm not saying that it's irrelevant here. But the immediate prophetic weight is in what I would call the regional configuration that surrounds Israel. North, South, East, West. Listen, you and I would not disagree on that aspect of it. It's just what is really going on with Trump? That's our only thing. And we both see the same going in the same direction, same conclusion.

Tom Hughes: What is really happening right now?

James Kaddis: And I think I actually think that what's happening right now with the President, believe it or not, is leaning in favor towards Israel and always has.

Tom Hughes: So what you say is going according to plan, what I say is not going according to plan. So I say Trump is reacting, you say, no, this was all part of the plan. In a nutshell.

James Kaddis: Don't get me wrong. I think that Trump has to do a little bit of reacting because there's going to be things that are unknown. So he's going to have timelines given him, he's going to have things that he anticipates happening and they don't happen, and he's going to react a lot.

Tom Hughes: Everybody has to react to whatever information you get each day in life, even if you're going to have lunch, you're going to react, where am I going? Then you've got to make a decision, right? So I get that. But I mean, I think you know what I mean. From you, it's going according to plan and Trump and Netanyahu know exactly what they're doing. They know there's going to be give and take along the way, this curb ball here and there. From the way I see it, it's not going according to the way Trump wanted it to. Trump wants a trophy. I think we would both agree Trump's a pretty prideful man.

James Kaddis: Fair enough.

Tom Hughes: But his goal is peace. His goal is to be the one who brought peace to that land. So hence Gaza, Abraham Accords, and everything going on right now with Iran and Israel.

James Kaddis: You're right. But Trump's pride is in the results. That's where his pride is. His pride is in the results.

Tom Hughes: And the result in this case will be a peace plan.

James Kaddis: I believe so.

Tom Hughes: And we just look at two different ways.

James Kaddis: I believe so. And I believe a peace plan with Israel in the most favorable position. I know I'm being called crazy for believing that. I get it.

Tom Hughes: I get it. And I would say it appears to me a peace at all costs.

James Kaddis: I definitely would disagree with that assertion. Great place to end the program. It was a great program. And for the record, I want to say this before we end. I think you're probably one of the smarter if not one of the smartest analysts over this, Tommy. I'm not discounting you. But honestly, bro, I want to say this. Like I'm not discounting you. Like I watch some people I'm like dude, you're an idiot. Like I'm not even going to you're just dumb. You don't know what you're talking about. You're not one of those guys. You're actually very smart.

So it causes me to think about what's being said. Like it causes me to have pause. I'm not saying this with just some level of impunity where I just go ah, whatever.

Tom Hughes: Hey, so appreciate that. I can't wait for the next program because we've got to talk about socialism, the rise of socialism in America. We can talk a little bit about the KGB and oh, that would be great. There's a lot we could talk about with KGB, not just God's most wanted.

James Kaddis: You can educate me on that one. All right. Well, we are out of time. So on behalf of the great Tom Hughes, we certainly hope that you've enjoyed watching this as much as we have enjoyed making it. I actually hope you've enjoyed it more than we have enjoyed making it. It's been a blessing. We love you guys. God bless you. Bye, everybody. See you later.

Guest (Male): You're listening to Countdown to Eternity with Pastors James Kaddis and Tom Hughes. Online at countdowntoeternity.com. You can listen to this episode again right there at countdowntoeternity.com. I should also mention Tom Hughes is online at hopeforourtimes.com. Take a look at his available resources and some of the top stories at hopeforourtimes.com.

Pastor James has a new book called The Last Book. Revelation isn't a book of fear, it's a book of hope. The Last Book is a guide to Revelation, giving you what you need to know about Revelation, the Rapture, and the end times. Learn what the Bible says about the days we're in and what God's promise is for believers in The Last Book by James Kaddis. Available right now at countdowntoeternity.com or amazon.com.

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