Ask Pastor Mike Fabarez

Speaker 1

Welcome to Focal Point. Today we've got a treat for the ladies in the house. Pastor Mike's lovely wife Carlin Fabarez joins us in the studio for a very special parenting edition of Ask Pastor Mike. It's coming right up.

Well, kids today have free access to a virtual Pandora's box of tech-driven entertainment. Just how do you set down reasonable limits and boundaries? How do you navigate around the pitfalls of social media?

Today on Focal Point, Pastor Mike Favares and his wife Carlyn discuss dating, social media, video games, and more. Let's join Pastor Mike and executive director Jay Wortin in the pastor's study now as they welcome a special guest and unveil the true purpose and calling of parenthood.

Speaker 2

Thank you, Dave. I am here with Pastor Mike and Carlin again and we are talking about Raising Men, Not Boys, the latest book by pastor Mike Fabarez. Welcome, guys. Good morning. How are you doing? Doing.

Speaker 3

Doing well.

Speaker 2

Awesome.

Speaker 3

Great to be here.

Speaker 2

Well, we've talked about a number of topics these last couple of Fridays, and today I thought we'd get into a little dating and gaming and videos and screen time and things like that. Does that sound like fun? I thought you liked that.

Well, I'm sure for your two boys, you guys told them, "Hey, you can't date until you're 30 years old." Right? That's what every parent tells their kid.

Speaker 3

That is not what we told our kids.

Speaker 2

What's wrong with that statement?

Speaker 3

And I'm sure people thought we were crazy, right? Because we were from the very early age and adopting what we say in the first chapter of this book that we really think you got to envision your kids' future every day.

We talked about their marriage, we talked about their parenting from the youngest of ages. I mean, it was just a normal part of our conversation with them. You are one day going to be a dad, you're one day going to be a husband, you're one day going to manage your own house.

It was just a part of our discussion, and we set them up for that.

Speaker 4

Absolutely. Yeah. And then when they, you know, got to the point where it might be a reality on the horizon, it wasn't shocking to talk about it.

Speaker 3

Right. And even dating, I mean, you know, there's a lot of minefields there, obviously, but. And I wrote that chapter about living in a world half full of women. I said it's one of the strategies. Not only in the early part of the book, I talk about, we don't like to talk about our kids being married or adults because we want to hold onto them as long as we can.

And that pet analogy, they're not our playthings. Right. They're arrows to shoot in the next generation. So that's a bad strategy. But when it comes to our fear of them in terms of their sexual purity or whatever, again, another strategy is to say, well, we're not going to let them date. We're not going to let them. We don't want them to think about that aspect of life.

But you're fighting a losing battle, as I try to write in that chapter, the hormonal storm that is brewing and raging in your teenager. We need to help them think about a virtuous and godly direction for all of that, assuming they're not Kingdom singles and not cease and pretend that this part of their future is not a reality, but encourage them to think rightly about it and prepare them for it.

Speaker 4

Absolutely. And then it's an inevitable part of them growing up. And in fact, I think, don't we want to be the voice that tells them the truth about it?

Speaker 3

Right. That's a great way to put it. Because if a parent takes the common strategy I hear so often, especially in Christian circles, we're never going to talk about them getting married, we're never going to talk about them dating. We're always going to put this off. Then we become silent or negative on the topic.

While their natural development is heading in that direction, their hormones are heading in that direction, and the culture is constantly feeding that. So we end up forfeiting all the opportunity to speak into this particular area of their lives with wisdom and guidance and direction.

So to know that their parents think that it is positive, that they are going to be attracted to women, that they're going to want to find a romantic person to fall in love with, all of those things, we want to anticipate that with a positive perspective, anticipating it in our discussion and then being able to direct that.

Of course, because sex and hormones are obviously a volatile area of their lives, we want to be able to help them, guide them, manage them, and coach them through that period of their lives.

Speaker 4

Absolutely.

And if we wait until they've left our home for them to realize that part, which will be a super important part of their life, we miss out on the opportunity for interaction.

If we wait until they're out of our home, we don't get that daily interaction and discussion about it, where we can actually come alongside them and help them make good decisions about it.

Speaker 2

So in terms of girls and dating, how did you train your boys to treat women right.

Speaker 3

I do talk about that in the chapter. And just trying to understand that women are not objects for your own pleasure and gratification. I know the hormones will make it appear that way in your bloodstream, but you're dealing with a very special creation of God.

I go back to Genesis; I look at what goes on there. Here is a special creation of God. After all the creative order was completed, God did it obviously for a purpose, and the sequence was for a reason.

These women are to be understood as a gender, to be valued, to be set on a pedestal, and to be treated with respect.

Speaker 4

Right. And that starts when they're little too.

They're not treating, you know, the girls at church or at school like they're icky or like they can't talk to them or they couldn't have a conversation or even, you know, play a game with them or something.

So it's not avoiding them, but treating them with the respect.

Speaker 2

So you did not limit them to not dating in high school or things like that. You allowed them to go out on dates and have girlfriends. How did that work out? What kind of things did you talk.

Speaker 3

About when you were, I think when.

Speaker 2

They were getting involved.

Speaker 3

Dating is such a complex topic. And a date, let's just define that. I mean, I know there's this courtship wars and all that, but a date is something I put on the calendar to say I'm going to, you know, meet at a certain time and a place and have a meeting. Of course, we're concerned just like every other parent that they don't end up in the back seat of a car having sex and losing their virginity. All this, of course, we care about.

But when we said, listen, we know you're going to have to live in a world half full of women, and one of those women is probably going to be your future spouse. We want you to learn to interact with women in a respectful, godly, self-controlled way. One of the ways I think to do that while they're still under our roof is to guide them through that process of those social engagements. Of course, we want them to be in public, we want them to be in the right place, and we want them to deal properly with the parents of that girl. We walk them through those steps, talk very positively about that, and make sure everything's above board.

When you have a culture, whether in your church or youth group, where this is looked down upon or it's scary to everyone, you end up with kids that go underground in their feelings. They become very covert about what they're going through in their hearts and minds. And it's not healthy; it's not good, and it's not right. I want them to be above board when they start liking a girl at church. I want them to talk about it. I want to walk them through the process. I want to say, okay, well, here are the parameters, the do's and don'ts, and every parent is going to set those parameters a little differently.

But as I say from the beginning of the book, I don't want to be a fear-based parent. I want to make sure that my rules, my direction, my guidance, and my coaching are getting them in a positive direction and not based on, "Well, if I let this happen, then this might happen." I want to deal with the "this might happen" very clearly in my exhortation and training of my kids.

I certainly want to walk them through the process of meeting up at the coffee shop, having that first meeting, and with our kids, you know, meeting with the parents. Even, you know, the dad saying, "I’d like to see your daughter socially." These are the processes that every parent goes through. I don't get into all the details, obviously, in the book. Every parent has to figure those details out, but I do want them to understand that the principles I think are positive, biblical, and godly. It's important to speak positively about it, like the Bible does, and then to use your parental wisdom in guiding them through it. The book of Proverbs has so much to say about this aspect of their lives.

Speaker 2

So much has changed, obviously in dating, since you and Carlin had been dating. You had telephones and you saw each other, but now we've got devices that we can text, we can FaceTime, and a myriad of other things.

How did technology play in your household, and how did you counsel your children, your boys on that?

Speaker 3

Right. Well, we did allow technology, but we were careful about how they could utilize that. Of course, there were limits. You know, we don't want to sit there at the table texting people. We don't want, you know, there's times to do without this, at night or in your room or whatever. You can't use these things when we're doing other things. They need to be used within the parameters that we think are reasonable.

With some kids that we have, it was obvious the expectation was there, and they weren't as attracted to that technology as others. So, depending on the kid, you're going to have to put some strictures in place and some parameters in place to ensure that it does not become a controlling aspect of their lives. Kids need to be outside, as we talk about early in the book, dealing with, you know, sweating and running around. Socially, they need to be face to face, in meetings, side by side, and in small groups.

I don't want screen time and interaction through Snapchat and all these other things to replace human interaction. That's what we're trying to push our kids towards. You're not going to stay home when it's small group time. You're not going to stay home when it's time to have a friend over. Or I should say, you're not going to stay away from that meeting. We want FaceTime. We want real human interaction. We know that tech stuff can be an artificial replacement and substitute for that, and it's not healthy.

Speaker 4

But we had, you know, basic rules of just courtesy. You're not texting someone after a certain time of night. You know, we had our, we decided together what that time would be. Just like we wouldn't call someone after a certain time at night.

It's courtesy to, you know, not only the girl that they like or the friends that they're texting, but to the parents of the person. And in fact, parents were a big part of our plea to them in texting and technology. We all understand that once you click send, that message is out there in cyberspace and it has a life of its own.

Speaker 3

We've had that conversation so many times. Anything you send, and I remember sitting there with my voice, anything you send, picture it plastered up on the walls of the church. Picture your girlfriend's dad reading it.

Speaker 4

Absolutely.

Speaker 3

Picture me reading it because I'm going to read it. I would put the fear of God in them.

Listen, it's going to be, you don't send anything and I don't care what technology you have; you think this stuff disappears. It doesn't disappear. And I got plenty of examples of that.

Anytime someone, and of course leading a larger church, anytime I see something like Snapchat, you know, blow up some issue in some teen's life, I'm going to share that at the table. I may not share the names, but I remind them and I put the fear of God in them that everything you put out there on any format through any app, it can be fully transparent in public. Nothing's a secret.

And we had that conversation a million times.

Speaker 2

That is such an important truth to remember where you're having a phone call and it's a he said, she said, now it's out there for the world to see. And you're like you said, it never.

Speaker 4

Goes away and it can always be sent and copied and pasted and manipulated. So we were always cautious, telling our sons, whatever you send out there, just imagine that everybody in your youth group knows it. Everybody, right?

Speaker 3

And see, in a home where a parent is parenting and it's not a child-centered home, you know, it may sound old-fashioned, but there are things to remind them of. You bear my last name. This is not about you and your reputation. This is about the reputation of our family and maybe even added, of course, as a pastor of a church.

And they know I'm more of a visible figure, but I remind them of that. You bear my name. You are not making decisions about your phone or your messages or your texts just for yourself. That affects the family; that affects all of us.

And so just to give them that sense of dignity and responsibility that they don't just live unto themselves is helpful. And that's what Paul's argument is whenever he deals with these issues of grace, gray areas, or issues of liberty. He says, you don't live unto yourself.

I think it's good for a child to recognize that you represent the whole family when you make decisions about what you're texting.

Speaker 4

And especially, I mean, think about the thrust of the book was a lot of it is about your son preparing to have a relationship with God. And certainly all this goes double and triple if they're professing Christ, if they're getting up and leading in their youth group, if they're standing up before the church and getting baptized, if they're making some kind of profession even before they're, you know, high school friends.

You're going to destroy your reputation and Christ's witness by what you text, by what you do on your dates with your girlfriend. I mean, you do not want to sully the name of Christ. This is even beyond our family. This is Jesus Christ is the person you're representing.

So if you have that element in your son's life, there's even more to talk about and encourage them in.

Speaker 2

We just were talking a little bit about phones and Snapchat and other social media type things.

What about games on the phones, games in the home, screen time in general?

What have you seen in the culture? And how did you train your boys up in that area?

Speaker 3

Well, it's funny because when they go off to college and they get to the dorms or whatever and they see their peers playing games, I mean they recognized how differently they were raised. Not that we didn't allow them to have games or game consoles; we did, but with limited times and all of that. I remember that often, when I’d see them playing games, I’d say, "Enjoy it. Games are for kids. You won't be a kid very long." I would just give them that sense of perspective that we're not going to be professional gamers and you're not going to be playing games as an adult.

Even recently, we've had conversations with our college-age kids about recognizing the sense that they said, "Well, I can't even see my dad doing this," and they want to be adults. There’s a sense in which they find games as an age-appropriate engagement with their childhood. But that's not the way gaming is today. I mean, video games are a huge industry targeting people that are, I don't know, 17 to 35. I've done this research before, but it's certainly not children. These are adults, and there are lots of marriages and lots of postponed adolescents who are, you know, in their basements, not getting married, not advancing, and not commencing with productivity in their lives. Gaming is the problem.

So, gaming was always limited in our household. The kinds of games they could play, the ghoulish stuff, the heads chopped off, all that—we're not going to let you play any of that. I finally narrowed it down to, fine, you can have the golf game, the football game, the baseball game, and the soccer game. We’ll let you do those and collect them as grandma and grandpa give you gifts at Christmas. But when they had gifts given to them, I would say, "I'm sorry, you're taking that to the gaming store; you're returning it." Because that's just not the kind of game we're going to have in this household.

Speaker 4

Right. Yeah, but you know, it sounds like we're not into games or fun. I just think that the fun and the games that we had, most of it, not all of it, but most of it we did together or you did with a person.

We have a ping pong table because we play games. With a person, not with a machine. And we play golf as a family and we go out and we actually interact with each other as we're on the golf course, playing a game.

Even if they had friends over, let's get the ping pong going, you know, let's play games together, let's do whatever. And even sports, a video game together with other people.

Speaker 3

And because I let them play a lot of these video games that were sports-based, even the sports as a hobby, and I'm not opposed to that. They recognize, even in engagement in following every stat of every baseball player, which they did as kids. They were all into that, and they recognize now as adults, you know, this can't be a dominant part of my life. I got bigger, more important things to do.

I'm not saying for the guy out there that follows every stat that this is a sinful issue. But I think as I was raising my kids, I wanted them to realize that these are things that you enjoy, perhaps to develop parts of your life. They may be an ancillary hobby as an adult, but they have to take a real backseat to important issues of life. You find gratification in other things other than keeping track of every, you know, stat on ESPN.

Speaker 4

Right. And actually part of that, I mean, I hate to say it, but part of the reason why some men play so many games is because not only do they not have wives and children, they're also not serving in the body of Christ.

You serve in the body of Christ on a regular basis. Besides your work and your family, you're going to be. Your life is going to be full of people and caring for them.

You will find that you have very little time for these superfluous hours of games. Not that you can't have fun in a reasonable amount of time, but it will just not become such an issue because your life is full of caring for real human beings.

Speaker 3

Right? And there is, there's. And as she said, there's always time for recreation, there's always time for refreshment, but it's scheduled time.

And as I say in the book, we rest so that we work right. We don't work for Friday so we can rest, you know, we're not living for the weekend, as the song says.

So we do train them that there's an appropriate time for getting away. Playing golf, playing ping pong, doing whatever, even playing a video game, I guess.

But we do try to recognize there are certain kinds of games that are kid stuff and, you know, I'd much rather see my boys throwing the football around as adults than sitting in front of a game console, you know, trying to kill people on the battlefield or whatever the game is they're playing.

Speaker 2

Well, Pastor Mike, as we finish up here, today's session, we've talked about a lot of topics over the last three weeks.

Maybe you could speak a little bit about the book and in terms of where parents are at. Perhaps they haven't been doing this with their kids so far, or maybe they're just getting started. Some might even have kids who are already out of the house.

How can your book help those people in all those different stages? Is it ever too early to start or ever too late to start?

Speaker 3

Well, as I sat and wrote this book, I would pray often that it would be a very helpful book for parents no matter where they're at and even for grandparents. I hoped it would be the kind of book that would give them some, as I say, the fleshing out of the biblical principles in ways they could understand. I wanted them to be able to take that nugget and put it to work, seeing how it could help advance the cause of maturity, godliness, and manliness in their sons or grandsons.

Ideally, I guess it would be great to start with a clean slate. It would be wonderful to have this book in hand as you're taking your baby home from the hospital, allowing you to start at the beginning. However, I believe there are principles here that can be beneficial at any stage. Many people who have seen the pre-release copy have told me that there are things they can glean from this book, even though their kids are 16 or 17 years old.

I also think that no matter what we feel we may have done wrong or missed out on, we always have an opportunity to influence children. In our church, there are lots of opportunities, and I hope everyone listening has a church home and a church family where they can get involved in helping the next generation. It’s important to think not just in terms of my family and my four walls, which is critically important if you have the opportunity to parent right now, but also to consider how you can help this next generation if you’re an empty nester or if your kids have moved on.

You can volunteer in your church, take a real interest in the teens, and get kids' names on a prayer list that you pray for every day. These are important contributions that every church needs—a whole generation of godly people investing in the next generation. I think of the young Spurgeon writing in his autobiography about how the most encouraging thing for him as a young person in his church was having these seasoned saints share their wisdom about what it means to follow Christ and be faithful to Him.

As my wife and I share when we get a chance to speak at various places about this topic, our grandparents both played a very critical role in our spiritual development as kids. We believe that grandparents can be a great asset to the development of their grandchildren.

Speaker 4

Yes, absolutely. It's never too late to invest in young people, whether you're related to them biologically or not. Definitely.

Investing in young people and investing in other parents who are in the trenches, I think, is key too. Getting this resource in their hand, praying for them, and being behind them as they try to put some of these nuggets into practice is essential.

Speaker 3

A lot of what we did together as parents was used in my mind to get a lot of these principles down on paper.

And I know when the book came out, you're sitting down reading this and excited to see what's in it.

I don't think anything was a surprise in it because a lot of this was birthed out of how we put God's principles and truth to work in our parenting.

Speaker 2

Well, I've been talking to Pastor Mike Febarz and his wife Karlyn. Thank you so much for being here.

The book is *Raising Men, Not Boys*, and it's the most recent book by Pastor Mike Febares.

And you can get it this month at Focal Point for a donation. And Dave is going to let you know how you can do that.

Speaker 1

Yes, I will. Jay Carlin, always a joy to have you with us.

And to our listeners who've enjoyed these past three interviews featuring Pastor Mike and Carlin Fabarez, you can find these Ask Pastor Mike episodes at focalpointradio.org.

Now, Pastor Mike, you've simplified parenting boys with clear biblical guidelines in a new book, and it's proving to be one of our most popular resources because it's so practical and simple. From page one.

Speaker 3

Yeah, that's right, Dave. The great thing about being in the family of God is that we're all given a new template. And if you've come from a background of less than perfect parenting, I want to make the whole process as simple as I can in this book. You know, sometimes the best way to get a fresh start is to get a simple plan, map it out, and get going on it. Consistently, diligently. Work at it.

This book, *Raising Men, Not Boys*, explains how God's timeless truths can be implemented in our daily decisions for our kids. I wrote these 11 chapters that cover a lot of different scenarios in parenting. I'm not trying to give a cookie-cutter way to parent, but I'm trying to offer some undergirding wisdom for the real-life scenarios that we face. I'm trying to give some instructive, helpful biblical advice. I'm trying to flesh out these principles in real-life application in a way that gives you some wisdom, some everyday sanctified common sense. Really.

I'll remind you, you're not alone too in this book. Hopefully, you'll feel that way when you read it, that God has made provisions for you and you can do this. God can give you what you need through the body of Christ. He can empower you. You can get this job done. I'll give you examples of what these timeless principles look like, maybe even a lot from my own family, how I flesh this out in my own home. But it's my hope that it'll give you some peace, some confidence, and really some optimism in your parenting role.

Speaker 1

If you're raising sons or know someone who is, or maybe you're a coach or a teacher working with young men, this is a book you'll want to keep handy. We'll send it along. When you give a financial gift this month, just ask for it when you call 888-325-885. The title once again is *Raising Men, Not Boys*. Find it at focalpointradio.org.

We're hearing from so many listeners who say they've become disillusioned with the humanistic and kid-centered teaching that's out there. And that's why they're so grateful for the Word of Truth presented without apology here on Focal Point. Your generosity is what makes these daily studies possible. We're dedicated to getting these excellent expository teachings to you every day so you can align your thoughts with God's unchanging truth. Truth. That's what empowers and refreshes you every single day.

So thanks for refueling this program with your much appreciated donation today. Again, you can give online at focalpointradio.org or call in your gift at 888-325-885. If you have questions for Ask Pastor Mike, we want to hear them. Post them on our Twitter or Facebook feeds where you'll discover others who are as passionate about God's word as we are. You can help others find Focal Point too; like us, follow us, or share our link. You'll find it all at focalpointradio.org.

I'm Dave Drouy wishing you a wonderful fall weekend ahead. Pastor Mike Fabarez continues his study on parental discipline next week, so be sure to come back Monday for Focal Point. Today's program was produced and sponsored by Focal Point Ministries.

Speaker 4

Sam.