Ankerberg Show

Jeff Planche: Hi, and welcome to More to the Story. My name is Jeff Planche, and with me is my cousin Michelle Ankerberg. This is a time where we get to sit down with a guest that John normally has on our regular TV programs, but we get to hear from them in a little bit more personal way and hear some of their stories and research that we just can't always fit into our regular broadcasts.

Today we have the great privilege of having with us the astrophysicist Dr. Hugh Ross. He is a genius and somebody I just love listening to, and I think you will too. Hugh got his PhD from the University of Toronto in astronomy, and then he went on to Caltech where he studied for five years post-doctoral research on quasars.

Michelle Ankerberg: Hugh, one of the things that people don't know about you is that you have Asperger's, which is part of the spectrum of autism. Talk a little bit about that, especially when you were younger, your story about that, and I also want you to give some hope and encouragement to people and families that have kids that have autism and what you would say to them as well.

Hugh Ross: Like most people on the autistic spectrum, I was verbally handicapped apparently, but it is apparent. My mother would say, "Hugh only has three words: yes, no, and cookie." You can get pretty far with those three words.

What I learned was if I did speak, I would get into trouble because people on the spectrum tend to be really blunt and honest. I got reprimanded for saying, "Oh, look at that lady, she's really fat," or "That man's really dirty." I basically said if I'm going to stay out of trouble, I have to keep my mouth shut.

Also, because I was quiet, all of my parents' friends in Montreal, where I spent my first four years, insisted that I was mentally handicapped and that I needed to be put into an institution. My parents, I could hear them saying, defended me and basically said, "No, we've seen what he does. Have you ever watched him play? He's not mentally handicapped."

Growing up in Vancouver, I was in school, I wasn't speaking, and also I had dexterity problems. I couldn't make a pencil make numbers and letters. In grade one, I was failing in all the subjects, and it looked like I was going to have to repeat grade one.

Six weeks before the end of the school year, our parents moved from a small rented house into a condemned home that they were going to rebuild. I had this grade one teacher, Lila Campbell, for just six weeks. Somehow she saw the frustration on my face and said, "Stay after school, I want to ask you some questions."

She had about thirty books on her desk, and she asked me questions about those books. She figured out that even though I wasn't speaking, I was reading. I had read the books and gave the correct answers. She said, "Look, I know you're failing in all your subjects, but I'm going to try to get you into grade two."

She went to bat for me with the principal and I got into grade two. At that time in Canada, your seating in the class depended on your academic standing. I was in the last chair. Even though the teacher never made it clear, all the students knew. I got teased all the time for being the class dummy. I said, "Okay, I'm going to have to talk. No matter how much trouble I get into, I'm going to start talking."

Between grade one and grade two, my parents said that I was obsessive. I was spending hours a day practicing how to make a pencil make numbers and letters. When I entered grade two, I could make the pencil do what I needed it to do. There would be a set of tests every few weeks, and every few weeks I'd move up a few chairs. By the end of grade two, I was in the first chair.

What I could say to parents who have children on the spectrum is they have a special gift. Help them find that gift. In my case, I kind of found it on my own. I went to the library and said, "I just love physics and astronomy."

What I share with parents who have children that are on the spectrum is to expose them to material that is eight or nine grade levels above where they are and see what grabs their attention. Typically, give them freshman college texts.

One thing you can do is put lines around a paragraph that you know they are going to be able to comprehend and see if their eyes go to the more complicated material. That is your clue, and then if that's all they want to study—and that's typical of people on the spectrum, they kind of get locked into just one subject—then you can encourage that.

Help them socially adapt. When I first met my wife, I was at Caltech, now in my late twenties, but she says, "You've done a lot of public speaking, you've been doing it since you were sixteen, but you always stare at the floor when you speak. Why don't you try looking at the audience?" I thought that was a novel idea.

That is typical of people on the spectrum; they have a hard time making eye contact. People think, "Hugh, how can you possibly have Asperger's? Your eye contact is great." I've been practicing for six decades. I share with parents, be patient. It is going to take time for your child to be able to engage neurotypical people.

Make sure they get time with the neurotypical people. I think what held me back was I was around a lot with people like myself, and we got to think we were normal and the rest of the world that's abnormal.

Jeff Planche: A common feature you mentioned with those with Asperger's is that they're generally trusted by young children and animals. In your book on *Hidden Treasures in the Book of Job*, I love you give a little story about your connection with animals. One of them I loved was with your pet parrot named Pedro. Tell us about Pedro and your bond together.

Hugh Ross: This is a parrot that my parents bought for the family, and that parrot immediately bonded to me and wanted to be around me all the time. He would actually sit on my shoulder, and every morning he would check my face to see what I missed with my razor and take care of that. If there was something in my teeth, he would take care of it. He didn't mind going into my mouth and everything, so I didn't need a toothpick or anything. He would do that.

Parrots are socially engaged, and I noticed that parrot was happiest when the room was filled with men. Whenever I would entertain the astronomy club in my parents' home, that bird had to visit all the men. For some reason, he didn't like women. I've known people who have had parrots where the opposite is true; they only like women and don't like men.

Mine liked men, and he liked my grandfather as well. I remember when my grandpa came to visit and I was thirteen, he said, "I like to play bridge." I didn't know how to play bridge, my parents didn't know, but he taught us. He said, "I want Hugh as my partner."

I was my grandfather's partner, and every time I won a hand, my grandfather would get all giddy. The parrot picked up on that and would do a victory dance on my shoulder. I remember my parents commenting, "It's bad enough to lose a hand of bridge to our son, but his bird gloats."

I can give you another story. I was sitting on an airplane with a woman who had all the signs of being on the spectrum. I just went over to her and said, "I can guess your profession." She says, "You can?" I said, "I'll bet you're a veterinarian's assistant." She said, "How did you know?"

People on the spectrum tend to have this way of calming down animals and of building relationships. I tell stories of walking in the wilds of Canada, running into animals that have had no contact with humans, and they want to bond with you.

It's not just with people on the spectrum. God designed these animals, the Nephesh animals, to serve and please human beings. If they haven't been abused by human sin, you can really see that property. I've taken my wife and sons into places like that and said, "Let me take you to a place where these animals have never been abused by humans," and they come right up to you. They want a relationship with you.

Jeff Planche: Maybe just explain Nephesh, because I'm guessing most viewers might not know what the word Nephesh means.

Hugh Ross: That's a Hebrew word that you see in the biblical creation texts, and it means soulish animal. The word *bara*, to create brand new what didn't exist before, shows up three times in Genesis 1. First for the universe, that's when God creates brand new the physical creation.

The second time you see that word is when God makes the birds and the sea mammals. These are creatures that are not just physical; they're physical and soulish and that are endowed with mind, will, and emotions so they can form relationships with a higher species, which is us humans.

The third time you see the word is when God creates human beings, male and female. We're not just physical and soulish, we're also spiritual. Just like these Nephesh animals were designed to serve and please us and relate to us, a higher species, we humans were designed to serve and please and relate to a higher being, namely God Himself. Those are the only three places in Genesis 1 where you see that word *bara*, to create brand new.

Michelle Ankerberg: Also along those lines talking about the animals, you've had some encounters with different animals, especially bears and things when you've been out camping and hiking. Give us a little bit about that, stories on that.

Hugh Ross: I knew my parents had never been camping before. They didn't have a car, so when they came to visit me when I was at Caltech, I said, "I'm going to rent a car, we're going to go camping in Yosemite." We go camping in Yosemite, I set up a tent for my parents, and then I just slept on the ground in a sleeping bag.

Middle of the night, seven black bears come into our campground. I was right in front, so they came by, they all sniffed me and walked away. I just sat there. There is nothing that I can do, but I didn't have food. I got up in the morning, every tent in the campground was collapsed by the bears except the one my parents were in.

Everybody was saying, "How come your parents survived and we didn't?" I said, "Well, notice I slept a good 150 feet away from them because my dad snores and he snores really loudly." I said the snoring was so loud he probably scared the bears away.

But I live in the foothills of Southern California, the foothills of the San Gabriel Mountains, so I see bears quite frequently when I go for my morning run and they seem completely unperturbed by my presence. One time I was in Colorado and I was up at 10,500 feet, which typically you're way above the level where bears go.

For some reason, I was confronted by this 400-pound black bear and he jumped out right in front of me. For some reason, I didn't get startled, which somehow impacted the bear because what he did is he walked a few feet away from me, sat down, stared at me, and let me take photos.

My wife and two of our friends were hiking behind me. I always hike fast because I want to take the photos. I told them this story and they said, "We don't believe you." I said, "Well, here it is on my camera. Take a look."

I've actually even had animals try to entertain me. I remember one time up in Canada, this big woolly marmot came out in front of me, saw me, and then did a little dance in front of me for about five minutes while I took photos. That's always fun, up close and personal.

Jeff Planche: Thank you for joining us on More to the Story. May the insights from today equip you to present and defend your faith with confidence. To learn more or view our TV program, visit J-A-show.org or subscribe to us on YouTube. Until next time, may God guide you in your pursuit of truth and empower you to share it with others.