Amazing Facts

Doug Batchelor: Years ago, I'm talking about 50 years ago, I was living in the hills in a cabin. This is not when I lived in the cave; it’s another time. I had a radio, and the only thing I could get was one Christian radio station. On this station, a gentleman would come on once a night and answer Bible questions. I would listen, and some were good answers, but some, since I knew my Bible, I thought were wrong.

I remember at one point, a college student called in. She said, "Brother, I’d like to believe in God. I’d like to believe the Bible and believe in Jesus. But the idea that God would take these creatures He’s created and plunge them down into hell and burn them for all eternity for the sins of one brief lifetime—I can't see any love or justice in that." He said, "Well, who are we to question God? That's what the Bible says, so we just need to take it." And she hung up.

Then, the next call came from a lady. You could tell from her voice it was quivering. She said, "Brother, I want you to give me a straight answer. My son died this last week. He did not profess to be a Christian. He drank, he was an atheist, and he ran into a tree and died instantly. Is he burning in hell right now?"

The host of the program did his best to try to evade a direct answer. He was beating around the bush. She said, "No, look, I’m telling you that he made no profession of God. He had turned his back on God, and he died. Is he in hell?" He basically said, "Well, there’s only two options, and he would be among the lost." She asked, "So he’s burning in hell?" He answered, "That’s what the Bible teaches." She asked, "And how long is he going to burn?" He said, "Forever." You could hear the lady choke as she hung up the phone.

Well, I got so excited. I had no telephone back then and no cell phones. I got in my car and drove 12 miles to a friend's house that had a phone. I called this national radio program, praying I would get through. It's all over the country, so the odds of getting through were just one in a million. The first time I called, there was a busy signal. The second time I called, I got through.

The person said, "Please stay on the line; you're in the queue." All of a sudden, the host came on. "Welcome to our program. What is your question?" I said, "Brother, I believe the Bible teaches that there is a hell, but that God is going to consume the wicked in hell. The Bible says they are burnt up, devoured, and perish. God is not going to torture them for all eternity. People get varying rewards." I began to give him all the scriptures.

There was a radio nearby, and I could notice that he had turned my volume off so people weren't hearing what I was saying. He gave some traditional verses, then he turned my volume back up. I gave some more scripture answers, and then he cut it off. He would not take any more questions for the rest of the program because he was trying to unravel the verses that I gave him.

On my way home, I was praying. I said, "Lord, I wish someday I could have a radio program where I could tell people what the Bible really says." Praise the Lord, about 30 years ago, God gave us a radio program. Pastor Ross and I answer Bible questions every night around the country and around the world. This subject is very important to me. Tonight, we’re talking about the good news about hell. I know that sounds like an oxymoron.

But the reason I say it like that is there are two extremes on this subject. If you do not understand this subject, it makes it difficult for you to love God or even understand the justice of God. It is extremely important. Now, there are two ultimate rewards: saved and lost. Jesus said you're with me or you're against me. There’s no Switzerland in this battle; there's no neutral territory. We don't want to spend a lot of time talking about where the lost are going to be; it’s just that we need to understand it because it says something about God and His justice.

So, we’re going to go through these Bible lessons tonight, and I’m going to give you scripture. I turned away from God when I was young. I went to two or three Christian and Jewish schools growing up. I went to 14 schools in total. I went to two Catholic schools, two Jewish schools, and two military schools. I went to the same military school as Donald Trump—New York Military Academy. That’s not a political statement; we didn't know each other, and I had no choice. It's just a fact I thought I'd share with you.

The reason I mention it is that we were required to go to services every week. My mother was Jewish, so one week I’d go to the Jewish services, which strangely enough were on Sunday. Another week, I'd go to the Catholic services, and then I'd go to the Protestant services. So, I had a mixed-up idea of God, but they all basically said the same thing: if you're good, you go to heaven; if you're bad, you go to hell, and you burn forever and ever and ever. I said, "God’s a sadist. I don't want to serve that God." I turned my back on God.

You’d be surprised how many people—Charles Darwin, Robert Ingersoll, Karl Marx—turned from God because they did not understand this subject. If they only knew what the Bible really said. Here are the two extremes. One extreme says God is love and there is no hell; everyone’s going to be saved. The other extreme says that if you're lost, you die and you immediately go to hell before the judgment. You begin to burn, and a million years later, you haven't yet begun to burn. You are burning through all eternity, and it doesn't matter if you are Adolf Hitler or 13 years old and committed suicide; you’re going to burn the same amount of time.

To me, that was mind-blowing. It just didn't seem like there was any justice. When I finally started reading what the Bible said, it was extremely liberating. So, don't rush out until you hear the evidence. You owe it to yourself to find out what the Bible says on this subject.

A couple of times, I've been to the city of Pompeii. Pompeii was a thriving Roman city at the base of Mount Vesuvius, a very prominent volcanic mountain. As early as 62 AD, they had rumblings and earthquakes. People knew that that mountain might blow. They knew what a volcano was. Vulcan was one of the Greek gods. The springs were drying up, and every now and then, smoke was burping from the top of the mountain. Hot springs would suddenly appear. They had all the signs that things were swelling and something was going to give, but the people waited for 17 years and didn't do anything.

Finally, in 79 AD, there was a magnificent eruption of Mount Vesuvius. The towns of Pompeii and Herculaneum were shaken, and much of them were destroyed. Thousands died, and those that were not buried by the ash were burnt alive by the pyroclastic cloud of superheated material that came down the mountain. They were later buried. Ancient historians like Pliny wrote about the destruction of Pompeii.

I've been there. When they started to excavate it in 1748, they discovered they were running into these cavities in the ash. One of the French archaeologists had an idea and said, "Let's pour some plaster of Paris in there and find out what this is." They filled these cavities with plaster of Paris, let it dry, and then they chipped it away. They found out it was the forms of people and animals that had been killed and buried in the eruption, frozen in time for almost 2,000 years.

As they cleared away the debris, they saw what Roman life was like back in 79 AD. A little amazing fact: the Roman soldiers that destroyed Jerusalem in 70 AD were believed to have considered Pompeii to be like the Las Vegas of that time. You can tell from the murals on the wall. When I went on a tour with the Amazing Facts board through Pompeii a couple of years ago, we basically had to say, "Do not take us to this section of the city," because it is so blatantly obscene. They thought we’d be very interested in that. We said, "No, let's skip that. Let's just go over here."

It was like the Las Vegas back then. Some of the Roman soldiers that had been involved in destroying and burning Jerusalem and the temple were vacationing in Pompeii when the city blew. You wonder if that was some form of divine justice. I don't know that, but I think it's interesting. They found all these forms of people that died in this massive eruption. It makes you think about a story in the Bible.

Now, we go to question number one: what two cities are given as an example of the destruction of the wicked? What does the Bible say? 2 Peter 2:6 says, "Turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes, they were condemned to destruction, making them an example to those who afterward would live ungodly." Did God rain fire and brimstone on those cities? They were burned, they were punished, and they were an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly at the end. Don't forget that.

Sodom and Gomorrah are set forth—this is Jude 1:7—as an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. Here’s a question: you've got a picture of Sodom and Gomorrah right there at the south end of the Dead Sea; are they still burning? No. Even in Jude's day, they weren't still burning, but he calls it eternal fire. Why eternal fire? Because the results of the fire that burned them were eternal. Those cities were never rebuilt.

In fact, I forgot to bring it with me, but a friend who has done some archaeology in the area says you can dig into the hills where ancient Sodom used to be and see these sulfur balls that are there. I've got several of them. There's nowhere else in the world you find this. Sulfur balls that fell from the sky landed in the ash and were extinguished on impact. Some of them were burning when they fell. When the Bible says He rained fire and brimstone—brimstone is sulfur—on them, it literally happened. There is literal archaeological evidence of it. I usually bring a piece to the meeting and set it on fire. It came right from that territory, and everyone gets to smell the rotten eggs in the auditorium. It becomes very visceral, you might say.

The story of Sodom and Gomorrah is not a myth. There’s no question about it. This is the lowest place on earth. Did you know that whole valley sank? It is one of the hottest places, about 1,400 feet below sea level. Revelation 21:2-8 tells us Sodom and Gomorrah were permanently destroyed. You can read about what's going to happen to the wicked at the end of time. Lot was rescued from the city at the last minute. Jesus said, "As it was in the days of Lot, so will it be in the days when the Son of Man is revealed." I think it was Billy Graham or his wife, Ruth Graham, who had said either God is going to apologize to Sodom and Gomorrah or we're in for trouble.

What do people out there in the world think about the concept of hell? Is it real? How long will it burn? Look carefully at the questions you're going to see on the bottom of the screen. We're going to go to the man on the street and the woman on the street and find out what our culture thinks about this idea of hell. They're all over the map.

Guest (Male): Probably a dark place after you pass away.

Guest (Male): That's where people end up if they don't want to be with God. That's the purpose of hell.

Guest (Male): The purpose of hell is meant for the devil and his angels, and it's to get rid of sin.

Guest (Male): Everything that is evil on earth or everyone, someday you will end up in hell. If you're forgiven, there's a chance you can make it to heaven.

Guest (Female): I would believe hell is a place that we will be tortured for eternity.

Guest (Male): Of course, there's language of fire and eternal darkness and stuff like that. Is it literal or is it metaphorical? I'm not sure. But what I do know is hell is a place of eternal separation from God.

Guest (Female): People, I guess, who had the chance to follow God's way, people who have the knowledge of salvation and all that and still choose to be sinners, then I guess that's just the place where they stay for eternity.

Guest (Male): It seems reasonable to think that the devil and demons will be there for eternity.

Guest (Female): I think hell is eternal.

Guest (Female): Hell could be eternal if you don't accept God as your savior.

Guest (Female): I don't think hell is eternal. I believe it's temporary because it'll allow you to repent and to do better.

Guest (Male): There are some people out there who maybe possibly deserve an eternal hell, but I feel like those individuals are few and far between. I don't think anybody deserves to suffer for all eternity. So, I would like to think and hope that it would be more of a temporary, symbolic, metaphorical kind of thing.

Guest (Male): I'm not sure, but I think whatever the case is, we're going to be there forever.

Doug Batchelor: One thing we're sure of after listening to this is that people don't know what they believe, do they? So, where are we going to get our answers about the truth about the punishment of the wicked? Where do we go? Jesus said, "Thy word is truth." We’re going to go to the Word of God and the teachings of Jesus. Let's find out what it says here.

Question number two: when will the wicked be destroyed in hellfire? First of all, the Bible is very clear. There is a hell. There is a punishment for the wicked. If you believe the Bible, Jesus made it very clear. When does it happen? Let's find out. 2 Peter 2:9: "The Lord knows how to deliver the godly out of temptation and to reserve the unjust under punishment for the day of judgment." They’re being reserved. They're not there yet. Has the judgment day taken place yet? Why would you take a person, put them in hell, pull them out, and say, "Yes, sir, you're guilty," and put them back in again?

So, people aren't being thrown into the lake of fire until after the judgment. God is just. Again, John 12, these are the words of Jesus: "The word that I have spoken him will judge him in the last day." This is sometimes known as the Day of the Lord, the great judgment day. Matthew 13:40-42: "So it will be at the end of this age. The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out those who practice lawlessness and cast them into a furnace of fire." Those who practice lawlessness are the ones going to the lake of fire. But when? At the end of the age.

Nobody is burning in hell now; the judgment has not happened yet. Here’s where the confusion comes in. If you die lost, you have no consciousness of time. Your next conscious thought is the resurrection before God's throne, judgment, and punishment. So, as far as you're concerned, it’s not very long between death and punishment. But we live in time, and it hasn't happened yet. So, for those of us who are alive, you don't have to worry about your loved ones who died lost being down there burning in hell now, because the great judgment day has not happened yet. You can look on the grave where it says "RIP," rest in peace. Good or bad, they're sleeping until that great judgment day comes.

For a person that dies saved, their next conscious thought is the presence of the Lord, right? But the Bible says the Lord will descend from heaven with a shout, the voice of the archangel, and then the dead in Christ will rise. For them, it’s instant. You can be happy for them. But it hasn't happened yet because we live in time. I hope that makes sense.

Number three: if the wicked who have died are not in hell yet, where are they? Let the Bible give us the answer. John 5:28: "The hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice and come forth." Those that have done good, the resurrection of life; those that have done evil, the resurrection of condemnation. Two resurrections are found in the Bible. "Dead in Christ rise first" is what it says in 1 Thessalonians chapter four. "The rest of the dead live not again until the thousand years is finished"—that’s Revelation chapter 20. So, you’ve got two separate resurrections. He says the hour is coming when those who are in the graves will hear His voice. Where are they now? They're in their graves.

Job 21:30: "The wicked are reserved for the day of doom. Yet he'll be brought to the grave, and vigil is kept over the tomb." He’s in the grave, he’s in the tomb, and they have no consciousness of time. What’s the only two choices for all people? Answer: "Whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life." Who gets everlasting life—the believers or the unbelievers? The believers.

But you know there are a lot of people out there that teach unbelievers get everlasting life; it’s just in the fire. Jesus said everlasting life is only given to believers. People say, "Wait, everybody’s immortal. You’ve got an immortal soul." The Bible says God and God only has immortality, and when the Lord descends, then this mortal puts on immortality. So, sinners die. The penalty for sin is death. The wages for sin is death. The gift of God is eternal life in Jesus Christ our Lord.

What was the first lie that the devil ever told in the Garden of Eden? God said if you eat the forbidden fruit, you will die. He said you will surely die. And the devil said, "You will not surely die. You'll either live forever in heaven or you'll live forever in flaming torment." But that’s not what the Bible teaches.

Number five: what will happen to the wicked in hellfire? Answer: "A little while and the wicked shall be no more." This is Psalm 37:10 and verse 20. The wicked will perish, as Jesus said. "Into smoke they will vanish away." What other words can God give us when He says "no more," "perish," "vanish away," "devoured," "gone," "dead"? I mean, the terminology in the Bible, I don't know what God could say that He didn't say.

Now, there are some difficult passages, but we’re going to look at them all, and we invite you to ask questions. You're free to disagree, and we hope no one will be disagreeable, but we welcome your questions because we want Bible answers. Amen? A lot of dear people are confused about this.

Malachi, the last book in the Old Testament, last chapter: "The day is coming, burning like an oven, and all who do wickedly will be stubble. And the day that is coming will burn them up." The wicked are burned up. They are devoured, they're consumed, they're no more, and they perish. "You will trample the wicked, for they will be ashes under the soles of your feet." Do they sound conscious at that point?

Psalm 21:8-9: "Your hand will find all your enemies; your right hand will find those who hate you. You shall make them as a fiery oven in the time of your anger. The Lord will swallow them up in His wrath, and the fire will devour them." That was an extra one; it didn't have an answer in it, but we just threw that in for free.

Number six: where will hellfire be located? In Crowley, Texas? It’s going to be on the earth. Where will hellfire be located? "The elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up." And you can read again in Revelation 20:9: "They, the wicked, went up on the breadth of the earth and they surrounded the camp of the saints, the beloved city, and fire came down from God out of the heaven and devoured them."

Do you have the picture? At the end of the 1,000 years, the New Jerusalem comes down from God out of heaven. All the saved are in the city; all the good angels are there. Jesus says, "I will separate the goats from the sheep." There’s a day when we will all be together again. He'll say to the sheep on the right hand, "Enter into the joy of the Lord. I was hungry and you fed me; I was thirsty and you gave me drink; I was naked and you clothed me; I was sick or in prison and you visited me." And He'll say to the wicked, "Depart, you cursed, into everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels." This is, by the way, Matthew 25:31. "For I was hungry and you didn't feed me; I was thirsty and you didn't give me drink; I was sick and you didn't visit me; I was a stranger and you didn't take me in; I was naked and you didn't clothe me."

And they’ll say, "Lord, when did we see you in any of these conditions and not minister?" He'll say, "Inasmuch as you did it not to the least of one of these my brethren, you did it not to me." So, there’s a moment when everybody’s gathered. All the lost—Satan and the wicked angels and the lost—are on the outside. All the righteous and the good angels are on the inside. The Bible says the devil will see this is his last chance, and he will rally Gog and Magog. That’s a term—it's not the Russian or the Chinese. Gog and Magog were Old Testament enemies of God's people. All the names in Revelation are symbolic. I just said something profound you shouldn't forget. All the proper names in Revelation are symbolic. Revelation talks about Jezebel; she’s dead and gone. It’s spiritual Jezebel. It talks about Balaam; it’s not literal Balaam. Balaam is dead and gone.