New Life LIVE

Brian Perez: Welcome to the New Life Live podcast. We hope to provide help and hope in your life through God's Word, counselors, and psychologists as we answer questions from listeners who call with the challenges of life. Let's go to today's episode.

We are so happy you’re here. I’m Brian Perez and this is New Life Live. We’re here to help you walk through real pain through real healing. Eating disorders, trauma, you name it, we can help you. Dr. Jim Burns, the founder of Homeward is here today. So is clinical psychologist, Dr. Alice Benton, who's got something on her mind to start us off.

Alice Benton: Brian and Jim, I’m thinking about the thousand-pound stories that we don’t want to tell about our past and maybe don’t even want to think about. But those untold stories are what weigh us down, keep us stuck, and can even keep us sick. God’s antidote to that is unfair forgiveness.

A woman named Jane told me, “I can’t forgive my own sexual promiscuity and the three abortions I had as a young woman. I was such a wicked girl, even though I knew God and I knew His ways.” Jane beat herself up in her head. She rarely talked about these stories, hardly ever, and yet the stories replayed in her own mind unbidden and she just felt horrible about herself, what a bad Christian she was.

She was a mild-mannered woman, very composed. She really looked like she had it all put together, so you would never guess from the outside what agony she lived with on the inside. She could not forgive herself. Part of the process of moving towards forgiveness is developing understanding, which can lead to compassion. There are reasons behind all of our unhealthy behavior and usually, we’re trying to cope with difficult circumstances.

Jane’s mom left their family when she was young for another man and never came back. Her dad was a great provider financially, but he was angry, lonely, and totally overwhelmed being a single father raising a young daughter. He turned to porn and to alcohol, and he didn't hide any of that from Jane, so she was exposed to things at a very early age that she never should have seen or experienced.

Her dad regularly told her she was a wicked girl when she didn't live up to his standards of perfectionism, so she already took that belief inside of her. So when boys at high school started to pay attention to her, tell her she was beautiful, she finally felt valued by them.

She began to develop a sense of compassion for herself of, how could I have been so sexually active at such a young age? Well, no wonder. It was one of the few places I felt loved because none of the adults around me knew how to love me well. But how could I have had those abortions? Well, her father pressured her to. Her mother didn't give any advice at all and the boyfriends pressured her too. She didn't feel like she had another option.

She began to develop compassion and understanding for herself, which led to the ability to forgive. Then we had to work on forgiveness for her father, which is so unfair, and forgiveness for her mom, both people who abandoned and mistreated her. But as we looked at their family history, they suffered abandonment. Their parents were ignorant. They had not learned how to love well.

If you have thousand-pound stories that you can’t tell and you don’t even want to think about, God’s inviting you into a process of moving towards forgiveness by developing understanding for yourself and your perpetrators, even if they were your parents, because when we can have compassion for ourselves and other people, we can get to forgiveness, which sets us free from justified bitterness and resentment.

Jim Burns: I feel like we were just at church. That was really good. Unfair forgiveness. And yet our Heavenly Father loves us not for what we do but for who we are. Somehow we have to learn that even in the midst when we’ve had a father or mother or somebody who wasn’t loving to us, our God loves us anyway.

Brian Perez: We are here for people just like Jane. That’s what we do here at New Life Live. You can find out all about us at NewLife.com. Call in when we’re doing a show. In fact, we’ve got some calls coming in.

To find out more information about New Life or to order any of the resources mentioned on today's program, call 1-800-NEW-LIFE. Now back to New Life Live.

Our first call of the day is Deborah from Philadelphia, who’s watching us on YouTube. So we’ll wave hi to Deborah. Thanks for calling into New Life Live, Deborah. How can we help you today?

Guest (Female): Thanks for taking my call. I wanted to ask you about unforgiveness because in the Bible it just talks about the brethren. It doesn’t say unbelievers. It just says you’re supposed to forgive your brethren. So I wanted to ask that first. Is forgiveness a broad spectrum type of thing or is it just for people in the church?

Brian Perez: I was going to follow up with you, Deborah, and ask you why you’re asking this question, but she said, “Let's get that question out of the way first.” So let's answer that question for Deborah and then we’ll dig deeper as to why she’s asking this. Jim, what would you say?

Jim Burns: I think forgiveness is for everybody, Deborah. I think God’s forgiveness is for people. Sometimes people don’t live under that banner and that’s their choice. But I think God is willing to forgive and I think we have to be willing to forgive.

I think it’s very important that I have a lot of people around me who aren’t Christians and don’t believe the way I do, but I need to show them love and forgiveness, and I think that’s how Jesus would do it. Jesus showed forgiveness to people who weren’t necessarily believers when you start looking at the woman who was caught in the midst of adultery or when you look at the woman from Samaria.

So I think we do have a biblical precedent to be people who forgive. I think that’s one of the biggest differences for Christians and non-Christians is that we’re going to forgive because that’s what God tells us to do. He’s going to give us the strength to do that.

Alice Benton: I respect your very close reading of the word, that you really want to understand what is God guiding us to do. There are things that He asks us to reserve for brethren in particular, and some of it is evaluating one another, calling one another out when we see sinful behavior. That is reserved for believers. But I think about Jesus being on the cross and saying, “Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.” I think He was talking about all the sinners that surrounded Him, both believers and non-believers alike. So how does our answer affect you?

Guest (Female): Well, I think that the Lord has been dealing with me. I was saved at a very young age because my aunt Elma and my aunt Stella were spinsters and they devoted their whole life to the Lord. They brought me to the Lord at six or seven years of age, but I didn't fully understand.

They did this because by the time I was seven, my father died of a brain tumor at 40, my sister got killed at 13, and my mother had a nervous breakdown. So they did not trust my mother. They thought she was a negligent parent, so my aunts were very concerned about me and they didn't know what was going to happen to me either.

My sister and this boy, they both died from playing chicken with the Long Island Railroad. So my mother put a wall up with me and I asked her why she was not warm and fuzzy like my girlfriend’s parents. They would give me big bear hugs, especially this one girl I got close with, an Italian family. She said she couldn't, that was for self-preservation. So I was always looking for it with men, with anybody.

Brian Perez: Are you struggling to forgive your mom? Is that the reason for your phone call?

Guest (Female): I’m struggling to forgive myself. I’ve done a lot of bad things. I think I’m a bad person. But I think we’re all bad because the apostle said to Christ, “Good master,” and He said, “Why do you call Me good? None of us are good except for the Father which is in heaven.”

Alice Benton: Deborah, I hear that you don’t think you’re good. I want you to know as I was driving to radio today, I asked God, “What do you want me to talk about in my couple minutes at the opening of the show?” It ended up being your story that developed in my mind in many ways. Jane’s story is your story to some extent.

Just like she couldn't forgive herself because she was so wicked, she couldn't believe what she had done, you have some similarities there. You’re condemning yourself for things that you’re perhaps ashamed of, you regret doing.

Guest (Female): Yes.

Alice Benton: Would you be willing to give us the headline of one of those things you struggle to forgive yourself for?

Guest (Female): Two abortions. I was 17 with my first one. After my son was born, I had another one at two weeks. I made sure it was at two weeks. And I wasn't a very good daughter. When I had my children, I developed an alcoholic problem. I can’t make any excuses and I won’t because I was just selfish and I wanted to have fun and I wanted to do what I wanted to do. My whole life has been, “Wait a minute, Lord. Let me go for a minute, I’ll be right back.” Then I’d see Him walking just visioning it, I’d see Him walking a couple yards and then maybe 80, 100, maybe 500 feet, whatever, and then I’d run to catch Him again.

Alice Benton: So Deborah, I’m going to stand in agreement with you that you have made selfish decisions. So I won’t whitewash that. I agree with you. You and I are both a couple of sinners and we knew better and we made bad choices anyhow. So there’s some selfishness in your life.

When we hear your story of losing really your entire immediate family, your mom was physically there but she was emotionally gone, these deaths so early in your life, and I want you to remember that part of Jane’s story was understanding that her poor decisions, her three abortions, she was trying to cope with her life being out of control and not having the leadership and the safety in her home that she needed.

You got some from your aunts and I’m glad you had them, but you did not have safety and stability in your home. I don’t say that to excuse the poor choices you’ve made. I say it because you, Deborah, need to have compassion for that younger you that made those decisions and now regrets them. I suspect, Deborah, that you struggle to accept God’s forgiveness of you. Is that true?

Guest (Female): I do.

Alice Benton: He tells us that He removes our sins from us as far as the east is from the west. He washes us as clean as snow. But Deborah, you’re not alone in not being able to receive that into your heart and we usually internalize that forgiveness when we can get it from other women around us who really know the nitty-gritty details of our story and they’re willing to forgive us and they’re willing to say, “Hey, I’ve made some of those same mistakes myself and I forgive you and I love you anyhow.”

Guest (Female): He doesn’t forget. Also, things were taken from David after what he did with Bathsheba and how Nathan came to him and rebuked him about that and how the first child was born dead. God will take things from you. I’m a devoted Christian and don’t take this wrong, but I also believe that He’s a consuming fire as He says and He is a very strict Father.

Alice Benton: Deborah, you’re right that there are consequences and there is wreckage and we do have to face that. There really isn't any way of getting around that. But I hear even in your reaction to me, I think it’s difficult for you to receive love and empathy. I don’t think you got much of it when you were a kid. So I ask you to let us connect you with a group of sisters with whom you can feel and practice soaking in love and grace and empathy. I think God gave me Jane’s story to give to you because He wants to call you in, call you in for comfort.

Jim Burns: Deborah, I think you’re right, there are consequences sometimes to our choices. However, I want you to hear this really clearly. Jesus looks at you and He knows all about you. He knows those abortions. He knows the talking back. He knows the string that you said was going to be for a minute and lasted a lot longer. He knows your closet. Nobody else knows your closet.

But I want you to know that He says, “I know all that stuff. And I have a word for you.” It’s from the Bible and it says, “You’re the apple of My eye.” I honestly believe that you’re not at this point able to accept His beautiful words to you. He says, “I will never leave you or forsake you.”

Yes, He has harsh words, and especially in the Old Testament, you see some of that and you’re talking about that. But there was a dynasty built from David and part of the dynasty is Jesus Christ our Lord. So God even in the midst of David’s brokenness and poor choice, He still used the line of David to bring our Lord to this earth, His Son, His only begotten Son.

So know that. He looks at your closet and He doesn’t condemn you. He in fact said to a woman who had really made some poor choices, “I don’t condemn you. Go and sin no more.” So I think what you do with the rest of your life is what’s so key. It’s not what’s your past. Your past has hardships and there are reasons for those hardships and you’ve got to work through those. If you continue to only deal with those, you won’t heal and when you don’t heal, you will repeat. But know that His love is much greater than any of that and I know none of us deserve it, but He says, “You’re the apple of My eye.”

Brian Perez: We have a tip sheet that I just found out about last week, so we’re going to send it to you, Deborah. It’s called Five Steps to Radical Acceptance. That’s what you need because you feel condemned. You’re just focusing on God the consuming fire who wants to just cast judgment for everything you’ve done in your past, but He’s reaching out to you.

You are a believer, we believe that, but it’s just sometimes it’s harder to forgive ourselves than for God to forgive us, to realize that, yes, all we have is His grace. So we’re praying for you also, Deborah. Stay on the line, we’ll send you this tip sheet. We’ll also put it in the show notes there. You can get information about it and we strongly encourage you, Deborah, and everyone else who needs it to sign up for the Take Your Life Back course that begins the first week of May here from New Life. It’s a 12-week course, one hour a week and you can find out about it at NewLife.com or by calling 1-800-NEW-LIFE.

Denise in Bismarck, North Dakota, listening on KNDR, you are next on New Life Live. Hello.

Guest (Female): Hi. It’s dealing with my daughter, she’s like 35 years old. About a year and a half ago, she had said that I had been a bad mom, that she wanted time and that she would let me know when she’s ready to deal with it. Well, there’s been lots of stuff with family and everything and like this weekend, I had left town, a sister had made a blanket for her baby, brought it back, texted her, how do you want to get it? I also sent treats for two older kids but the daughter just will not communicate at all.

She’s had struggles forever. When I was seven months pregnant, I had a brother commit suicide and then when I'd cry, she would go wild in the womb, so I had to kind of shut down. And I know you guys have talked about something about neuro. It was a struggle with her with school growing up. She had been a really outgoing kid and stuff but she would like one day the teacher said, “Okay, everybody can go out to recess but not her because she’d been kicking her shoes on and off under the desk.”

Brian Perez: Yes, she’s a long-time listener, you can tell. She hears the music and she says, “Oh, it’s time for the commercial break.” Yes, you’re right, Denise. So stay on the phone, we’ll come back to you and we’ll get to other calls as well because we’ve got lots of people that are calling into today to New Life Live to hear from Dr. Jim Burns and Dr. Alice Benton.

People who are at low moments in their life, maybe struggling with things that have been going on for years, decades. We are here to help you at New Life. It’s what we’ve been doing for decades. You can find out more about it at NewLife.com. Lots of great resources there for you to check out but we’ll be back in just a moment on New Life Live.

To find out more information about New Life or to order any of the resources mentioned on today's program, call 1-800-NEW-LIFE. Now back to New Life Live.

Denise, there’s that music again. You know what it means this time though, right? It means we’re back from the commercial break. Hello again. So what would you guys offer to Denise?

Jim Burns: Denise, I’m so sorry for the pain that estrangement causes. I’ve never heard once a family tell me about estrangement and then say, “And it’s a really good thing.” I mean, there’s times when we need a distance for one reason or another.

I’m going to give you some thoughts that kind of go against the grain of some things. What we a lot of times in estrangement, especially when we don’t totally know, your daughter said, “I’m going to take a break here and one day I’ll get back to you,” and then she’s not communicating well is, I think parents can take the lead by not saying, “Here’s why you’re wrong,” and I don’t know that you’re doing this, but, “You’re wrong and I’m right and it’s all these things.”

I think you simply one day say, “I would love to meet with you and I don’t even want to I’m not here in any kind of judgment. I’d like to hear how I can be a better mom to you in this next generation.”

Now again, there’s times when you can have a conversation. It’s not the first conversation. And she may not do anything. And you say, “If you don’t mind, I’d like to connect back with you just to see if we could have that coffee in six months.” So you’re going to go with her lead. And in estrangement with adult children, we always say that if you go with their lead, they will come back.

Here’s the good news. The good news is you have this gap which is horrible, but the good news is they eventually will probably take that on, especially if you’re showing love and you’re not preaching at them and you’re not telling them how wrong they are. So I think you slowly but surely tiptoe back into the relationship. You might have a hundred things you want to say and I’m saying, say none of them. I’m saying, just listen to her.

Guest (Female): Well, I understand what you’re saying. I do listen to you guys and various things. One thing said to reach out and say, how about just for an hour, I won’t say anything, I’ll just write down what you tell me how things were and I’ll just review them and bite my tongue the entire time because you want to say something? No response.

Her husband that she’s married to, he’s a bit of an introvert also and she used to tell me how bad it was with him and his dad. Well, now his dad is retired and he’s connected with them because of the grandkids basically is what I was told. So when she cut it off with me, I said, “Oh, and is he doing that with his dad too?” And I was basically told that’s none of my business.

Alice Benton: So Denise, if you’ve made multiple attempts and she’s not responding, then she may be taking your attempts as disrespect of the space she said she needed. And so you may want to wait for a while and get deeper into your own individual work. To have gone through the suicide of a brother and then the difficulty of having a young child, I can only imagine.

Doing your own work and preparing for that humble listening that I believe you will get the chance to do eventually, but you may have to hold off on contacting her for the time being.

Guest (Female): She had her third child six months ago. She sent me a picture. I did ask about dropping things off for the kid and I dropped them off, didn't see anybody. But and that’s who my sister made the blanket for. But it’s like she I can see between her and I, but my family’s always been good with her. And I’ve always fought for her like when she struggled in school, education program, the principal said, “Let her fail.” I went to the superintendent of public instruction.

Alice Benton: Denise, you have advocated for your daughter, you’ve fought for her, and you continue to try to serve her. So it doesn't really make sense that she calls you a bad mom and needs so much space from you. I’m going to give you a tactic that has worked with other clients that I have provided therapy for.

After I get into individual therapy with someone like you, Denise, after a while, I call the adult child and I ask if they’ll give me a feedback session and they give me information that I then bring to the parent and we work on that information together. So even though she won’t take your call, she may take your therapist’s call and be willing to provide you with information.

I’m going to leave you with one last challenge. I think you want to explain why you might have struggled as a mom, and certainly the loss of your brother, and you want to show her the good things you did to help her remember the good mom you were. And you have good reasons for that, but that can come across as defensiveness and as minimizing the difficulty she did go through with you as a mom. So practice telling that to other people, but hold it back when you get the chance to talk with your daughter.

Jim Burns: That’s exactly right. It’s so hard and it’s so complicated. Because she sent you a photo of the child, that’s huge. It’s much bigger because what I hear a lot of times is, I didn't even know they had another baby. And so that’s a good thing. She’s tiptoeing back and it’s not like what you want and it’s not like what the family wants.

I want to give you a suggestion of a book. It’s one of my favorite books on estrangement. It’s called Reconnecting with Your Estranged Adult Child. It’s by Tina Gilbertson. It does not come from a faith background, but it’s so good on doing what Alice said to do, the way we kind of do this. I’d pick that book up. It might really, really help you.

Brian Perez: Denise, thanks for calling into today to New Life Live. We’ve got more time so we’ve got more calls and that’s good. So we’ll get to as many of you as we can, all of you if we can, I think we can. So stay on the phone if you’re on hold right now and we’re going to do that. That’s our goal to get through all the calls that are on the board.

So hang on, we’ll be with you in just a moment. And by the way, if you can’t call into the show when we are here in the studio, you can leave us a voicemail or send us an email and the directions on that are on our website, NewLife.com/radio. That shows you the email address and the phone number to call.

Hello, it's Becky Brown and I am so excited to launch our 99-for-the-one partner initiative. Every day we hear from people all over the world who are looking for hope. They've been lost in a relationship struggle, addiction, anxiety, depression, all kinds of ways and it reminds us of the story in Luke 15 where the shepherd leaves the 99 to go rescue the one.

We've seen God work in the lives of so many people over the years here at New Life and we want to invite you to be part of what God is doing. 99-for-the-one is our partner program that you can give to the ministry on a monthly basis to make sure that we continue to reach out to the lost. Call 1-800-NEW-LIFE, 1-800-639-5433 or NewLife.com/9941.

To find out more information about New Life or to order any of the resources mentioned on today's program, call 1-800-NEW-LIFE. Now back to New Life Live.

If fear or anxiety have been quietly running your thoughts or stealing your peace, we want you to know there’s a way forward. On April 14, Becky Brown, the president of New Life Ministries and one of our co-hosts here on New Life Live, is leading a webinar on Zoom called Freedom from Fear and Anxiety.

Now this isn’t about pretending fear doesn’t exist. It’s about learning how to face it with biblical truth and practical tools that actually help. If worry feels constant or your mind won’t slow down, this could be an important next step. The webinar is live, online, and just $24.99. You can get all the details and register now at NewLife.com or just text the word webinar to 28950 and we’ll text you back the information you need and include a tip sheet.

Phone calls. Sarah in Sacramento listening on the New Life app, welcome to the show.

Guest (Female): Thank you. My question is about anxiety. I have ADHD and on-the-job performance anxiety. So my past work history is very choppy and I’m 60 and a new nurse and I was fired from my first job. It was very hard. The training part, I kept telling them I can’t learn this way but I didn't tell them I had ADHD, which I probably should have.

It’s just been affecting me. It took me a long time to get through nursing school, not academically, but because I had anxiety on the clinical floor. There were no drastic mistakes made or no patients in danger but when my professors would come around, I’d just get anxiety, couldn't think, couldn't verbalize stuff and so I was kicked out of nursing school. But through God’s mercy, got me back in at another school and I did become a nurse but I’m still having problems maintaining a job and all that stuff.

Alice Benton: You are a warrior. You just don’t give up. Oh, I’m so proud of you that you found another school, you made it happen, and now you’re working. You just don’t let your anxiety keep you down but I hear it keeps trying to knock you down.

I wonder if there are some symptoms of PTSD, post-traumatic stress disorder, from getting fired from that first job. So to complicate things in addition to ADHD and anxiety, I think that was a very disturbing event in your life along with getting kicked out of school. I would encourage you to consider whether or not you’ve done enough grieving and processing of those two things.

In addition, I would guess you’ve had harsh authority figures, probably going back a long way in your life, maybe even one of your parents, and I think that fear might have grown in you from a pretty young age. So it’s not just learning some coping skills that you’ll learn in our webinar if we can get you there, learning some coping skills, making sure your medication is up to date and you’re on the best, right medication for you, but also looking at what history has helped to keep you so anxious that you’re going to get in trouble from someone or they’ll be mad at you.

Jim Burns: Alice said medication. Sarah, are you on medication for your ADHD and anxiety? A lot of times they’ll put that together.

Guest (Female): I’ve tried medication for ADHD, which worked awesomely, but I can’t take any of I’ve tried so many because it triggers migraines in me. Anxiety I’m not on any right now because I don’t feel like I need it, I don’t have a job. But it only works so much, I feel like I need so much more, I need a breakthrough of some sort.

Jim Burns: I think that’s always hard. I appreciate that because I don’t think people should just jump to medication and I think you try everything. But there is I mean, God I think is a part of medication and I think it’s important that you just don’t throw that out.

I do realize that there’s a lot of people who have ADHD who also blend in an anxiety medication, it helps them with their ADHD and their anxiety. And I think that’s a real popular way that they’re doing it these days.

Within your job situation, one of the things about nursing is it’s such a caregiving and such a wonderful thing, but there’s different types of nursing. And what you may want to find is a job in nursing that doesn't have the huge anxiety thing. I realize you can’t always just say, “Well, great, I want to do this.” But there are positions where it may not be as intense or as stress-filled and you may still get all of your love for caring for others and for the medical world and all that you’ve worked so hard in as she said you’re courageous person.

I would look in the field, what would make a list of the types of jobs that you would want because you could thrive in that. There’s people who have ADHD and with a bit of anxiety who are great in the medical field. I know people who are in it in counseling and they’re great at it. They can understand, they can identify.

You don’t want to be in a totally stress-filled type of a situation because of what you are doing. At the same time, make sure you get the work done. Don’t stop. Get the counseling you need, get the help you need, be in a group, call New Life, get their stuff, go to this webinar that’s coming up, learn, learn, learn and you can be I think you can take all that you have, all the good you have and really make a difference in people’s lives. That’s why you’re a nurse.

Alice Benton: I was sad for you when you said, “Well, I’m not doing any of it now because I don’t have a job.” Oh, don’t wait until you’re in your next job search or in the next job actively. Get stability now even if you’re feeling okay. There are lots of good supplements for anxiety like L-theanine and ashwagandha. I take those for my anxiety along with Zoloft, an antidepressant. If I can do that, I can stay calmer and I love better and I perform better when I’m less anxious. So please start taking care of yourself now.

Brian Perez: Sarah, we’re just going to send you a registration for that webinar that’s coming up on April 14. Stay on the phone, we’ll send that to you. Everyone else who wants to sign up, just text the word webinar to 28950. We’ll also send you a tip sheet on anxiety. Ivette in Fontana, KKLA listener, welcome to New Life Live.

Guest (Female): Hi. Thank you for taking my call. I wanted to get your opinion and scriptures or a way to I have a 22-year-old cousin who I’ve taken care of since 10. I want to know how much should I intervene, support, help.

She made a decision a couple of years ago to leave the home that she lived in with me and now she’s living with like a boyfriend and she’s pregnant. I want to do the godly thing and not like she’s knocking down my door to ask for help, but I have been very loving toward her and positive concerning everything but at the same time just sending her scriptures and things like that about what God has said. So how much should a parent help? I want to help her.

Jim Burns: I think for one thing, thank you for the gift you gave her at a young age is pretty amazing. You’re not the biological parent, but she probably looks to you with that kind of authority too. And you’re doing it. You’re showing love, you’re showing her positivity and sending scriptures as long as she’s okay with that.

There are sometimes parents or loved ones like yourself who do that and they’re like, “Quit sending me scriptures,” and then I actually as much as I love God and I love scripture, I kind of go, “Well, you got to back off of that.” But if she’s okay with that, fantastic.

The next move would be for you to on a somewhat regular basis hang out with her. She’s moved away, she’s with this boyfriend, but think of the turmoil she must be going on. Maybe you can be that steady person at Starbucks with her on Wednesdays after work or whatever it might be and bring joy to her life, bring your love and so that when these harsh issues happen, she will move to you in terms of safety.

She’ll move to the God that you love and that can help her. People who are that young, they have stories and they have a testimony and they get bumps and bruises and she does too. But the fact is there’s some wonderful churches as you know in the Fontana area and you probably go to one of them, so invite her and help her find how important that part is, especially as she’s raising a baby.

Alice Benton: I’d have you, Ivette, ask her, “How do you want me to be in your life and are there things I’m doing that rub you wrong?” My son right now, he doesn't want any hugs or touching from me, but he wants me to play cards with him and he wants me to play Nerf guns with him. So I’m making adjustments from the way I like to love him to the way he wants to be loved by me. Not easy for me to do, to be honest. But it can be done with help.

Jim Burns: Do you have a Nerf gun in your purse is the question? We don’t want to get shot here in the studio.

Alice Benton: At all times I now carry it with me. So you better treat me nice, Jim.

Jim Burns: Okay, we’re going to. I don’t want that Nerf gun.

Brian Perez: This is New Life Live. We’ll be back with more calls, so standby.

To find out more information about New Life or to order any of the resources mentioned on today's program, call 1-800-NEW-LIFE. Now back to New Life Live.

We live in a fallen world. Your support helps people get the help that they need, whether it's marriage or other relationships, mental health, addictions, spiritual battles, grief, or even a combination of things. You hear these struggles and others come up on the calls that we get here on New Life Live every day.

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Brian Perez here with Doctors Alice Benton and Jim Burns and let's talk to Esther, who watches us on YouTube in Los Angeles. Esther, welcome to New Life Live.

Guest (Female): Hi, my New Life family. How are y’all doing today? Nice to talk with you guys. I’m so happy to be on the call today. My question is super simple. My husband and I, I’m 35 years old female and he’s a 40-year-old male. His name is Steven and I’m Esther. So I’m wondering what is the biggest factor in bringing children into this world?

Is it like you have to have a perfect family? You have to be Christian? You have to go to church? Because Psalm 127:3-5 does state that children are a reward from the Lord and blessed is the man whose quiver is full of these arrows. That being said, I see celebrities doing witchcraft having babies and I don’t have no kids yet but I do believe that the Bible is true that whether the babies are from witchcraft or not, it does say biblically speaking that children are an inheritance from the Lord. So I want to believe and pray for that in my own life and my husband’s life for us because that’s what I feel in the spirit.

Alice Benton: Esther, it’s one of the great mysteries to me and it’ll be one of the questions I want to ask God right away of why did You give kids to the people You gave children to? I work with couples that want kids, can’t have them and they look at parents around them who don’t even seem to care if they have kids and yet they keep having more.

So it’s really confusing how God assigns which children to which family. Do you want children or are you nervous about it? Do you feel unprepared for it?

Guest (Female): I definitely want children whether or not it’s from the foster care system or my own womb but I’m believing for children from my own womb especially in this time of my life, but I’m always willing to work with God’s timing as I am a firm believer in Jesus Christ. So the answer is yes.

Alice Benton: And do you and your husband have hesitations about it because of maybe difficulties you went through in your family of origin or worries about bringing kids into such a messy world right now?

Guest (Female): No, I don’t think so. That’s not the reason. I firmly believe in the biblical truths and who God is in our life but the only reason I’m saying something about it is because we got married last year. So I hear about newlyweds babies like honeymoon babies and all that and I’m like, “Oh.” So the spirit of comparison wants to come in and creep in and then the spirit of jealousy or whatever, but I just rebuke those thoughts in the name of Jesus and I just keep going and just stay on the race and the course that the Lord has given to us, me and my husband.

Alice Benton: So it’s not hesitation to have children, it’s actually the sadness of not having children yet. That’s more burdensome for you.

Guest (Female): Exactly. Yes, ma'am.

Alice Benton: And how can we help you with that? Help me understand your question better.

Guest (Female): Well, my question is like, is my faith lacking if I use fertility treatments like IVF and stuff like that? Would you say like, “Okay, you can go ahead and do it,” because I do have family members, my uncle did use IVF and he has twins that are absolutely beautiful. They’re like twins. So I’m like, “Oh my god, that could be also my story as well.” But it is through IVF and but you got to remember that IVF is like six figs. So sometimes insurance doesn't cover it.

Jim Burns: A couple things. I think like you said children are a gift from God but I think you and your husband would be a gift to a child. You have a firm foundation, you have a firm faith, you are excited about this child. This child’s going to be raised in a really great home. You sound really cool. I’m going to want a cool mom like you. So I think your child I think you’re gift to your child. How great is that?

You’ve only been married a year. Are you struggling with infertility? Have you been diagnosed with infertility? Because you’re going to IVF when in fact there’s many steps before that. Or is that just a concern because of what’s gone on in your family history?

Guest (Female): Exactly. Just the only reason I did state that is because my uncle it came through for him, IVF came through for him. So I’m like, “Okay, maybe who knows if it’s on my dad’s side or my mom’s side.”

Jim Burns: I mean, at this point nobody’s going to diagnose you for this young unless there’s another story as infertile. And so what you want to do is go to your OBGYN, get checked and see if that’s a process that you may go to but most of them would say probably hold on, wait and work through other things.

People don’t jump typically to IVF, they jump to other types of things going on and that’s what I would do. I wouldn't get too far out there. I call this kind of personally tailored discipleship which means I think there are people who God definitely gives them a direction when it comes to infertility and then God also says to somebody else, “Well, maybe not this way for you.” But I wouldn't spend too much time thinking about infertility. It’s in the back of your head because of what’s gone on with your family, but I would enjoy your first year of marriage and make sure that you’re getting the help you need with an OBGYN who can really check you out. Same with your husband as well.

Alice Benton: I wouldn’t jump to that either yet. I would also have you Esther and Steven pray about where God might be leading you because having a foster child is on your heart and that’s such generosity. Oh, there’s so much need for that. And so considering your different options, talking about it with your husband, and you might consider some couples therapy sessions to talk this through and or having your pastor give his opinion into your spiritual concerns about is IVF okay, spiritually speaking.

I don’t personally have any qualms with IVF from a spiritual standpoint. My hesitation can be when embryos are frozen and left and I think that is a baby who’s already been conceived and I think we have to take great care with that. But I think IVF itself, I don’t have spiritual hesitations about it.

Brian Perez: Esther, thanks for your phone call today on New Life Live and we are about five weeks away from the start of our New Life courses. There’s three of them: Lose It For Life, Healing Is A Choice, and Take Your Life Back. These are 12-week counselor-led online courses that meet one hour a week on Zoom. They’re all designed to help you break free from unhealthy patterns and move toward emotional and spiritual wholeness.

Where can you learn about all these courses? Of course, at NewLife.com or you can call 1-800-NEW-LIFE. God bless you guys. Thanks for being with us today. We’re going to do it again tomorrow. We hope you can join us then. Thanks so much for watching, thanks so much for listening, thanks for praying for us and for our listeners who call in and some of them just in just horrible situations. Just keep them in your prayers because they will really appreciate it. God bless you guys.

Thanks so much for listening. We hope something you heard will help you live in freedom today. If this content was helpful for you, we would love it if you would take a minute, leave a review, post about it, and rate it. Remember we have resources and workshops online for you as you continue your journey. Go to NewLife.com to find out more information. And thank you for being part of the New Life community. We know that God desires all of us to live a life of wholeness and healing and we're so glad that you're here.