First Love

Dr. Robyn Kassas: Welcome to First Love with Dr. Robyn Kassas and Dr. Nathan Kassas, where faith meets real life. In this weekly broadcast, you'll discover practical and spiritual keys to reclaiming God's story in your life, deepening your relationship with Jesus, and encountering Him as your first love, whether for the first time or all over again.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: No topic is off-limits as we make Jesus real, relevant, and relational. Stay with us. Your journey back to first love starts now.

Hello everyone, and welcome to today's broadcast. My name is Dr. Nathan Kassas. I have with me the wonderful, the extraordinary, the well-spoken Dr. Robyn Kassas.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: I could say the same about you too, son. Using adjectives every day to encourage you and strap you in with courage to believe that about yourself.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Thank you so much. Well, Pastor Robyn, Dr. Robyn, Mom, all those titles that you wear, wow, what a powerful episode yesterday. This was like another level. This is something that the church really needs to get a hold of.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: Just don't get caught up in that word, "schema." It gives you a vision more. It keeps it simple, which is good.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: We're not actually going to concentrate too much on the schema today because we've done a lot on that. We did move into yesterday how schema leads to scheming.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: We gave you some examples of that, like with Saul. Unfortunately, that schema in his head was that everybody has rejected him as king and they want David. That led him to do something about it.

Sarah was a big one. Give Abraham the young wife before he can leave her for a younger wife. A scheme would have been along the lines of her forgetting that she was old and God was giving her a promise.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Wow, somebody listening needs to hear that. So today, if God is asking you to throw away the old but keep the ancient, there's a distinction. The "old" category is schema and scheming. But "ancient," Dr. Robyn, if we take something out of someone's hand, we put something better back in there. So what are we putting back in their hand instead of schema?

Dr. Robyn Kassas: We're going to put back God's Rhema.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: I love it. A Rhema will turn a schema into a dreamer.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: You got that word quickly. I couldn't even get it out of my mouth.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: I just want to encourage people. I am actually going to dive a little bit more deeply into scheming and what happens around that in the brain’s weight, because I think there are some important keys there. We're doing 21 days of interruption.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: Oh, that's excellent.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: So I'm going to help you if you're listening and you want to get more information. Go to torcc.org because I'm developing some blogs that talk about specific steps to break down scheming. Recognize: is this a schema, a scheme, or a Rhema? Dr. Robyn has given me the permission to write some important neuroscience information on that, as well as tying in the spiritual and the physiological. But I want to really dive into your expertise, Dr. Robyn. Rhema, this is your expertise. Take it away.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: Well, what do you want me to talk about? We're supposed to know what a Rhema is. That's directly from God. That's not via your schema.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: It's funny here because if I could just add a biblical example here, it is Jacob. Jacob is a supplanter, a briber, and someone who is always moving via his schemes.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: He is totally scheming.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: He comes to this place where he wrestles with God. Before he can move out of being a schemer into a dreamer living God's dream for him, something has to take place. That something is a name change. Something has to change in his identity. There has to be a complete divorce from how Jacob has done things.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: It comes down to not just how he thinks, but how he's done it and how he's performed it. It's how his mind operates and how he thinks it works.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: It's that root system that God is coming for. As well as establishing and keeping true to the established roots, He's also coming for the rotten roots. In Jacob, He really comes for the rotten roots. He literally is encountering Jacob's scheming personality when He wrestles with him.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: And he does it all through his life. He's scheming all the time through his life. He's always scheming about something, about the sheep and the genetic manipulation. He's a manipulator. He put the children and the wife in front.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Scheming is full of manipulation. You cannot scheme and not manipulate.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: I'm telling you, a scheme is not a Rhema. It is not from God. It's your way of getting an answer to supposedly what God has done. You scheme to make it happen.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: You've always talked about how God moves, He never maneuvers.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: That's right, never.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Man maneuvers into place something that is already created, but God creates what's not there through His movement.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: Man maneuvers, and he takes things and he places them. No, God does not do that. God reveals them. He doesn't place them.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: We maneuver people, places, and things, and we call it God.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: It should be called schemes.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: That's it, as a result of our first root system, schema. So Jacob is a schemer at this point. He knows how to produce his own multiplication. He's sent his wives forward to die first if Esau is going to kill him. He comes to this place at Bethel where he meets the Lord and he wrestles. What's he do in his choice as well?

Dr. Robyn Kassas: He schemes.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: At Bethel, he dreams of the ladder. He sees that great thing. But isn't it funny how even as he's dreaming, God still hasn't changed his name? You can begin to tap into God's dream, but you can manipulate it into your scheme.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: You cannot manipulate your scheme. You have to let God wrestle with you, and then you will get the Rhema.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: God lets him dream the dream of the ladder and the DNA ascending and descending in heaven.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: But his interpretation comes into it.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: His interpretation of that dream becomes a scheme. Just because you've seen a part of the dream doesn't mean you haven't made it a scheme.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: Being shown by God means you have to do it His way, His word. If it's His word, then it's His will, and it has to be His way. That's what makes it different from you, because your ways are not His ways.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: So Jacob gets the dream and sees a glimpse of it, but now he begins to scheme. God has to bring him from Bethel to Peniel, where He wrestles with him and has to change his name completely from schemer, supplanter, and manipulator to Israel, meaning prince. We talked about the hip; He touches him in that place where it's literally like being born again.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: It's not even him running away from God; it's him running to God. When you are not scheming, you run to God. You don't run away from Him.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Ladies and gentlemen, this is too hot for me. I have to take a break and let Dr. Robyn's words land. We will take a break. Hopefully, I'm going to go and dream and not scheme. I'll come back with a Rhema.

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We are back. I've gotten rid of my schemes. I've taken in some good dreams, and hopefully, I'm going to develop God's Rhema from this dream.

Dr. Robyn, we were talking about Jacob before the break. Before your schema constructed the identity from what happened to you, God had already spoken your real identity over you. How does that correlate with Jacob? God never gave Jacob the name Jacob.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: No, his actions gave it to him.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: And his mother developed a schema of him that predicted how he would live out his future.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: So in a way, he inherited it.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: She said, "Right, because you're grabbing the hand of your older brother, and the Lord told me through a prophet that the younger will be served by the older. This is how you're going to do it, Jacob. You're going to take what's yours throughout life." But that schema created the very thing that we all fear. Her scheming actually caused Jacob to become a schemer.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: He's a usurper, taking something that's not his.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Because Jacob grabbing onto Esau's heel in the womb as they're coming out, she assigned an interpretation because of her own place that she was at.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: It was really her will and her way she did it. She didn't allow God to assign an interpretation to that action. She didn't believe that if God was saying this, He'd perform it. So she had to help Him along with schemes. A scheme helps Him along, just like Abraham helped God along to give Sarah what He promised.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Let me just quickly bring in some neuroscience and biology. This is what we do when we get stressed and when we don't let the Rhema regulate our nervous system. Stress narrows our attention towards immediate control. Stress tells you to control it immediately.

As an addition, Jacob's repeated strategies are shaping his identity until God confronts it. He confronts the pattern beneath the behavior. Sometimes the behavior you use to protect yourself from your very schema is the very behavior preventing that from being disproven.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: When you say that, can you repeat that again? I want to just change a word there.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Sometimes the very behavior you use to protect yourself from your schema—

Dr. Robyn Kassas: Or your mind. Just say it in that way so it will land.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Sometimes the very behavior we use to protect ourselves from our mind is the very behavior preventing the mind from being disproven.

And this is Rebekah. She is doing this. She has a feared future and it's handled through manipulation rather than trust. Because she fears that that word that was spoken won't come to pass, she has to add additional evidence.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: This schema that we talk about, or this blueprint, or this mind, it can cause you to move right out of God's will. You move into manipulation to make something happen. You should not. If God has said it is going to happen, there is nothing on this earth that's going to stop it except you.

We need to know that God will bring to pass His word if we believe and don't interfere.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Again, going back to Rebekah, her brain reinforced that "I did this." The sign, her brain reinforced her control was what made it happen. That got passed on to Jacob. "I did this. I made those sheep multiply. I took my birthright."

And this is where God is wrestling with him at Peniel saying, "Listen, you did nothing."

Dr. Robyn Kassas: I think this is the conversation we have to have with the Lord. Our mind has a language. We need to have this conversation that we did nothing, that He does everything.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: All we did was show up. Availability. Just turn up. Available to receive His ability. I'm realizing now my mind wants to reinforce the control mechanism, the additional evidence that I've added that God never added. Sometimes I can look at the heel being grabbed and go, "Yeah, that was God. That reinforces the word."

Dr. Robyn Kassas: That blueprint can look like that sometimes. It can look like, "Wow, I can see what's happening." But you can't, because He unfolds it step-by-step. He unfolds it prophetically from the finished product back to where you are now.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: When a schema becomes a scheme, we can start manipulating and manufacturing evidence for the lie that we already believe. So now we have to get out of this because we're in a pit in this scheming. Let's move to what God is bringing us back to. This is where we come back to the essential of the ancient and the Old Gate, because the Lord does something here. The Lord interrupts our scheming.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: He exposes it.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: Your schema may say get revenge, but the Lord says forgive them. That doesn't fit in the brain. Your schema may say lie so you can remain safe, but the word says speak truth. The Law is the interruption to my scheming. It's because He loves us and because the Law is all about God's love.

What is Law? Love aligning me with His will. The Law is not merely telling you what not to do; the Law is love stopping you from repeatedly practicing the behavior that is strengthening what is destroying you.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: Killing what's killing us.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: That is powerful, Dr. Robyn. The Law is killing our schemes. That's why we fight it so much. It kills us being able to be a dreamer. We need dreams. If God is taking away the schema, He's replacing it with His Rhema.

Rhema is so important because Rhema also can use our experience. It doesn't throw away our experience. God wants us to use our experience but to point to His Rhema.

Dr. Robyn Kassas: Rhema is full of God's love because He won't share something with you just for something to do. It's because He loves us.

Dr. Nathan Kassas: I can allow the Lord to bring back those things I've experienced and expose the trigger in His healing power like He does. But here's the key: the Rhema says pause because you don't have to obey the first interpretation. There's another interpretation awaiting for you to discover it. A better way.