Regaining Lost Ground

Intro Song: He's calling wake up child. It's your turn to shine. You were born for such a time as this. Such a time as this. He's calling wake up child. It's your turn to shine. You were born for such a time as this. Such a time as this.

Guest (Male): You will be in challenges in God's will. That's why we need endurance. Matthew 10 says you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures will be saved, not give up. Get over it, Shane, not everyone's going to like you. What am I supposed to do with that? Unless I'm misquoting or in error or a lot of arrogance, sure. But if I'm just preaching my heart out, people are not going to like it.

We rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance. Moving forward, he says you need endurance to get through the will of God. Thank you for joining us here at Westside Christian Fellowship, located in Leona Valley, California, one hour north of Los Angeles. Today on Regaining Lost Ground, we hear the fourth part of the message titled, "If All Is Well, Why Am I Like This?" and is from the sermon series through the Bible.

English writer and preacher John Bunyan, when speaking on humility, once said, "The people of the Lord in humility are to lay themselves and their prayers and all that they have at the foot of their God, to be disposed of by him as he in his heavenly wisdom sees best. Yet not doubting but God will answer the desire of his people in the way that will be most for their advantage and his glory."

Please join us as Pastor Shane encourages us to honor the Lord today, clothing ourselves in humility, quick to forgive and quick to submit to one another in Christ's love. We encourage you to listen to this message of hope, allowing the Holy Spirit's peace to fill you, that peace that passes all understanding found only in a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

You can hear the whole message at Pastor Shane's YouTube and Rumble channels. Make sure to subscribe today. For more information, visit us online at westsidechristianfellowship.org. We also encourage you to hear more truth from Pastor Shane with the Idleman Unplugged weekly podcast. And now, from Westside Christian Fellowship in Leona Valley, California, here is Pastor Shane Idleman.

Pastor Shane Idleman: He's not telling you to submit to a church that is ungodly or to leaders that are abusive. There is obviously something there. But as the leadership of this church submits to the needs of the body, which we do that more than you even realize. It's constantly submitting to the needs of the body. As a result, the body submits to the direction of the leadership. It's mutual submission, mutual yielding.

At this church, I hate to burst anyone's bubble, but I am not the CEO leader of this church. This is not Shane Idleman's church. When you leave here, you say Westside Christian Fellowship is my church, our church, because we are led by a plurality of elders. David's here, David's back there, Abram's here, Joe's not here, Bryant's here. They lead the church and I'm the equal. I'm the leader among equals.

I'm the loudmouth. I'm the one that gets the most criticism. I'm the one getting the most shots. I'm the one dealing with the most issues. Then others, it's a plurality. So making financial decisions: Where does the money go? Relational decisions: What happens? Do we ever have to apply church discipline according to Matthew 18? Let's all get together. If you've got four guys saying something and I'm off, I have to submit to that leadership.

It's even in our bylaws that I can't do something if it's outside of the group. So far, to my knowledge, I don't think we've ever really disagreed on anything profound. The only thing they stopped me from doing is I wanted to send out something showing the difference between Mormonism and Christianity to all these homes in Rancho Vista because I was mad at all these Mormon missionaries going door-to-door. My attitude really wasn't right.

There are other things that we just have a talk about. We agree. What the church really does is they submit to a plurality of elders. The reason this can be challenging sometimes is because we lead a vast majority of people. Some are sitting on the sidelines. Some come now and then. Then there's a core group who's really involved. We know them well. Then you have the leadership. You have deacons, elders. You have to navigate this big picture.

Sometimes it's hard to submit for two reasons. Number one is the enemy will plant a spirit of offense in our minds. All of us, me too. Instead of erring on the side of grace, we want to question and challenge everything. Which again, at its root is not a bad thing because you want to know what the church is doing. But often what people don't know is leadership often sees a fuller picture.

People are wanting answers: Why is this happening? We see a fuller picture. We see both sides of an issue. For example, one big issue, I think we're pretty much on the same page now, but we're working through this is with the seating problem. The best option is actually to get chairs. Nice chairs you can actually easily sit 50, 60 people more per service because then all of you have to scoot in because we can see if there's an empty chair next to you.

We're not in a hurry to do that. Is that the best use of money? We actually do ask our core team, 15, 20 people: What are your thoughts of this? Then when we did the roof, the $50,000 roof, we brought it up to the congregation. We told the need. As leadership, we have to be very wise because we've learned over the years that there's a lot of Chatty Cathys. There's a lot of gloomy gossips.

We've been clear for a long time. We believe that part of our calling is missions, but not necessarily overseas, although we do have some. We support them. We'll support more. Our mission we feel also is to our Judea, Samaria, Jerusalem, here to our own community and to our nation. Our heartbeat is for our nation to repent. We are going to probably spend more money on buying the radio station and different things than another church would be who's gifted in having missionaries.

Another church might be focused on community networking and painting houses in neighborhoods. You see how that works? God has called different churches for different reasons. That's why we submit. God is doing this here. We submit to that type of leadership, if that makes sense. There's different ways of doing things. Obviously, though, if a church is doing something wrong or there's big concerns, if I pulled up in the 2022 Lamborghini, right?

You might want to... we live in a fishbowl, so we're very careful with things. If you're not being good stewards and say we're asking for money every single week. We need money, guys, we need money. You're like, "Well, what's going on? Where's the money going?" That's why we paid off this facility a couple years ago completely. The whole campus was paid off. We save. We have missions. We have a pie chart that if somebody wants to see it, they can see it.

We actually operate very low on our administration cost. At this church, it's only 25%. Most churches are at 50% of their budget goes to administration, church facility, and all that. We are very low. Everything else is factored in there. We also believe in being strategic with missions. For example, did you know the average missionary costs... and this is from the Southern Baptist Convention... the average missionary will cost a church 85,000 a year to support a missionary?

We have found if you go to the area, indigenous people and somebody who's already in Brazil, let's say, and you make that person a pastor. He's already a Brazilian. He already lives there. He already knows the language. He already knows the people. It takes about 3,000 a year. We can support 30 indigenous missionaries, getting them Bibles, buying goats, pigs. You can do that.

You can help with goats and milk and support that a lot more than spending money on somebody from the States going over. There's a lot of ways. Missionaries from the States aren't a bad idea. It's a good idea. But you can see how people might do money differently. There's also a big church over here on the west side. I remember when I was in construction and finding out it cost 18 million dollars to build.

I was kind of critical for a while. Still, I think you can find a nice big industrial complex for two, three million and really save some money. So I kind of got rid of my judgmental spirit. But see, I wouldn't do that. Why did you do that? We just need a lot more grace on all sides. I personally still don't think that's a wise investment, but I'm going to leave that up between them and God.

We have to realize that not everyone is on the same page with things. We wanted to fully exhaust the pew and chair issue for a while, get prices, what does this look like, what does it really do before we let anyone know. Even as of now, we're not going in that direction unless God changes that. Also, leadership has dual responsibility. I have a responsibility to the congregation, number one.

But then I also have a dual responsibility to God and to others in the congregation. What we might do here might hurt you. If we handle something a certain way for this group, this group gets offended. We have a responsibility. We have to take things to the Lord and make some decisions based on the needs of the church. Also, leadership should err on the side of confidentiality.

We don't always vent everything that's going on because you've got how many people watching us online all over the United States. Church is like a treadmill these days. I've noticed over the years, let's say over 12 years, is somebody will come and they'll want to do something or let's say we'll do something and make an appeasement. For example, the communion on Sunday mornings.

Great idea. Somebody brought that to our attention. That's not a bad idea. Then they're gone in six months. We just did this for you and now you're gone. That happens all the time. People come: "Well, I think we should do this." Okay, that's a good idea. Then they're gone. At what point do you say, right now, I think it's just me and three people in this room that have been here the whole 12 years.

We make decisions what's based on the whole church and going forward in the church and the future of the church. Often we err on the side of confidentiality. It doesn't mean we're being secretive. It means we're being selective on certain things. I know there was a church I used to go to. Me and my wife, we actually met there. Every week in the bulletin, I guess we don't have bulletins anymore, but they would print in the bulletin how much we collected.

$44,000 that week. I remember I was like, "Oh my Lord, 44,000 in a week. I'm not giving." Am I alone in that? Who else would think you've got to be kidding me? But also, people say, well, that's transparency. Well, it is in some cases, but it's also can be very detrimental in other cases. Biblically speaking, there's some gray area there on how do you handle tithe and offering.

Do you pass it around all the time? Do you tell? Because the first couple years, whenever we would say, "Okay, here's what we're doing. What do you guys think?" You'd have a hundred different people, you'd have a hundred different opinions. Especially when it comes to finances. For example, we have a pie chart. This much to administration, this much to payroll, this much to missions, this much to budget, this much to savings.

We have it available. But not everyone agrees. Why aren't we spending more here? Why aren't we doing more here? Why don't you go plant a church over there? Do you have 2.5 million? That's about what the building would cost. Why didn't you do this? Why don't we pave this? Why don't we put grass back here? Oh my goodness. We all have different desires just like your own checking account.

With the church as a plurality, we make decisions on what is best for the body. If there's something big, the roof, we mention the air conditioning units going out. When we redid the flooring, we bring big issues to the congregation so they know. That's basically the submission issue. There's a safety in a plurality of elders. That's why the Bible encourages that because there is safety in submitting.

I'm going to open up about my own self. When I would go to churches, why's that pastor have a Mercedes? Now, I think we need to be careful, of course. You don't want to be over the top. But I was: Why'd they do that? Why'd they build that building? I mean, there's a big one out there in West Palmdale, I won't name names. But I remember $18 million. I was in construction back then. $18 million. Why don't they just go... I was so critical.

God began to deal with me about a critical heart because it's so easy to get offended. Everything can offend us if we let it. That's why yielding is so important. I'm going to err on the side of grace. I'm going to err on the side of grace unless I know something is fact. See, that's the difference. Many times we don't know something is fact.

Actually this week, we had a... it's going to be a pretty challenging situation here at the church. I don't know with the certain issue dynamic going on with a family member or family, I'll just leave it at that. But I mentioned to the guys. I said, "Listen, all of this is speculation and opinion. We don't have any proof." Proverbs says to see both sides.

I have an idea. I'm thinking this is not going in a good direction. But before we act, we need the proof. That's what a lot of people... we just have to start erring on the side of grace, unless of course it's a big deal, main issue, you caught somebody in lying, cheating, of course. I'm not saying that. But the problem isn't that we err on the side of grace. The problem is that we err on the side of judgment. That's where it gets really challenging.

I don't know if I put this quote up here from Leadership Pain. It's a book I'm reading right now. "The best leaders have to endure the most pain." I wish I read this 12 years ago. "Many can never have more influence because they didn't have a big enough leadership pain threshold." Isn't that amazing? If you are not hurting, you are not leading.

I'm hoping this might help somebody. This isn't just a book for pastors, but this is just in general. That pain threshold. You've got to be able to deal with pain, relational pain. That's how you grow. God will only give you what you can handle. Those who can deal with the most pain often God begins to give more people and more influence and more things.

When we're pushing people, here's with Westside Christian Fellowship. This is one of the most true statements I've ever written. "When you're pushing people to be closer to God, when you're convicting them to make deep meaningful changes, when you're convicting passivity and calling out sin, your fan base drops significantly." Yes, you can take pictures. You can tweet it. You can write it down.

That's just the truth. I've noticed over the years, unless I want to turn into Joel Osteen or if I want to remain Shane Idleman, I'm going to upset people. That's what God has called me to do. When you're pressing people to draw closer to Christ and get here for morning worship! "You keep telling us to come to morning worship?" Yeah, because I want you to draw closer to Christ.

"Well, I don't like that." Well, good. I'm just telling you. When you begin to convict them about areas of their life, they don't like it. It convicts them. Your fan base completely drops and you are now the target of their shots. I'm just teaching the truth. I'm just telling you what's on my heart, what scripture is teaching, what we're going through.

Back to this point: "Two nations are in your womb. Two people shall be separated from your body. One people shall be stronger than the other, and the older shall serve the younger." Ships are safest in the harbor, but they are not made for the harbor. Amen? Ships are safest in the harbor, but they are not made for the harbor. I've got some bad news and good news. What do you want to hear first? The bad news?

I'm only halfway through the sermon. The good news is part two is going to be really good. I don't want to rush through it. One group of people I do upset more than any other group, two people: carnal Christians and Pharisee legalistic arrogant Christians because I call them both out. You want to know why? I've been both.

I can go to this side real quick. Stop praying, correct? Stop praying, no more worship. Let me get my Great American country back on. George Strait. Alan Jackson. I'm going to date myself. Who's the new one now? Dierks Bentley. I'm going to get carnal again. Let's have some alcohol at our Bible studies. Let's have... and you start to get carnal again.

"Let me go... I know it's R and there's nudity, but man, it's so good." See, I'm drifting. I'm becoming carnal as a pastor. Or the Pharisee: "There are sinners in this room. How dare you come into the house of God. God's wrath is upon you. You'll never measure up. How dare you blow it. How dare you not live a holy blameless perfect life like me. I've been doing that since I was 18 years old."

They're red and they're upset. But I call them both out. The arrogance and the carnality. Carnal Christians, that's not... everyone's still laughing. I don't know what's so funny. That was too good, though, huh? That was... maybe there's some coming out of me. That was so real, I guess I should say. But carnal believers will mock you.

One thing Morgan and I have lost friends over the years and thought we were friends, but you're hanging out and was like, "Hey, I don't really want to watch Harry Potter. I don't really want to get drunk tonight. I don't want to do that." Now they don't like me. "Hey, I can't go to Laughlin and Vegas and do this all the time and I'm really wanting to seek God." "Oh, you super Christian. You're super spiritual."

Carnality does not like to be called out. When you start talking about the fullness of the spirit, worship nights or worship mornings or prayer intercession, living a holy blameless life, they don't like it. Let's not forget the vision Isaiah saw in six. I'll talk about it Wednesday. "I saw the Lord high and lifted up. His train filled the whole temple."

The angels cried, "Holy, holy, holy." Actually the seraphim, they covered their eyes and they covered their feet. They probably covered their eyes because they couldn't see the glory of God and they covered their feet in shame. They just cried, "Holy, holy, holy." The doorposts shook and that doorpost was probably 27 feet tall, 6 feet wide. Those foundations just shook with the holiness of God.

Holy, holy, holiness of God. So you can call people to holiness and those who don't want it will rebuke you because they love their carnality. "Don't call me out. I love my sin." So you have those against you as well. Anybody have family and friends against you? Whoo! Man. It's unbelievable. Unbelievable. It's like, I'm just trying to live for Jesus. Why all the hate?

That's a good shirt. I just thought of that one. But isn't that true? I'm just trying to love Jesus. I'm just trying to follow God. Why you hate on me? Here's why. Your lifestyle will convict. You don't have to say a word. Oh, goody-two-shoes. You don't have to say... have you ever upset anybody and you don't say a word? You just live your life.

So be encouraged. That's part of the journey. That's why these are so important. Let me just read these. Matthew 10:22: "And you will be hated. You will be hated by all for my name's sake." Matthew 10. It's Isaiah 37, you see that one too. I wanted to break down this whole thing of in God's will, but the time clock kept ticking.

But you will be in challenges in God's will. That's why we need endurance. Matthew 10 says you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures will be saved, not give up. That tells me I'm going to be hated. Get over it. Not everyone's going to like you. They don't... you will be hated for my name's sake.

When you say things from the pulpit, people will not like you. What am I supposed to do with that? Unless I'm misquoting or in error or in a lot of arrogance, sure. But if I'm just preaching my heart out, people are not going to like it. Romans 5: "We rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance, and endurance produces character, and character produces hope."

Intro Song: He's calling wake up child. It's your turn to shine. You were born for such a time as this. Such a time as this. He's calling wake up child. It's your turn to shine. You were born for such a time as this. Such a time as this.

Pastor Shane Idleman: Hello, this is Pastor Shane Idleman. I want to tell you about a new booklet I just released titled, The Dark Night of the Soul. This book came from a very challenging season in my own personal life. Dark seasons reveal what we actually believe, not just what we say we believe. The phrase, "the dark night of the soul" captures a moment we all dread. It's the moment when the floor drops out from underneath us and we realize that we are not in control and we come face-to-face with something we cannot fix.

Time and time again, God demonstrates that what appears to be the end of something is actually only the beginning. So again, I want to encourage you to take time today and download my new booklet, The Dark Night of the Soul, for free right now at westsidechristianfellowship.org. Again, download it for free at westsidechristianfellowship.org. It is on Amazon, but we're encouraging people to go to our church website where they can actually download the booklet for free, the PDF, and share it with friends and family at westsidechristianfellowship.org.

Guest (Male): Westside Christian Fellowship is located 60 miles north of Los Angeles in Leona Valley, California. Thank you again for listening to today's message of Regaining Lost Ground, where we are reminded daily, times change, truth does not.

Intro Song: He's calling wake up child. It's your turn to shine. You were born for such a time as this. Such a time as this. He's calling wake up child. It's your turn to shine. You were born for such a time as this. Such a time as this. He's calling wake up child. It's your turn to shine. You were born for such a time as this. Such a time as this. He's calling wake up child. It's your turn to shine. You were born for such a time as this. Such a time as this. He's calling wake up child. It's your turn to shine. You were born for such a time as this. Such a time as this.